Holodeck ethics and deepfakes

[Yukaphile]

Unless the AI is sentient. Then you get into the issue of AI rights.

[9ansean]

I'm with Yuka. As long as that pedophile is abusing fake children, then he isn't outside abusing real one's. And yes, I did feel uncomfortable writing that, but here's the thing: I have read articles online from people who advocate violent video games that killing fake people lets them unleash the anger and rage that they would otherwise be inflicting on their wives. Disgusting honesty i know, but ignoring the scum of humanity just because it makes us feel uncomfortable is not a solution.

The issue I can see though is that too often rape and paedophilia is not about sex, its about power. Some people just like the idea that they can make someone else cry. The ''holodeck treatment'' is far from foolproof for the simple reason that a holographic victim is only faking being afraid.

The human race is capable of both great love and great cruelty in equal measure i'm afraid. That is not going to change.

All very sound points. The only problem is that all the years of extensive study on media effects have really been more consistent in their inconsistency. That is to say, the lack of consistence long term effects for various test subject. Even within a very limit sample of a not very diverse population, the same media could still yield very different results.

Yes violent video games could be cathartic for some, but that could also serve as build to greater violence for others. As we so with Tuvok in Meld, not every attempt to relive aggression through holodeck murder fantasies can neutralize violent cravings. (even if the intended the target isn't Neelix.) In fact many find such attempts at precursive therapy only encourages greater outbursts. As you said the "holodeck treatment" if far from foolproof.

With paedophillia you have the same dilemma. I found a quote from a United Nations worker who specializes in child abuse. She said that viewing child pornography-even by paedophiles has sometimes been an outlet for desires leading only to masturbation, but other times it has been prelude for future sexual activity with children. Even that which may not be the cause, might not be the best treatment either.

I think that in general all sexual assault is about power in some way, but it's mistake to say that's never about sex. Anger based assault are almost certain removed from sexual motives and based more on attempts to punish or frighten. On the other hand, cases of date rape are almost certainly sexual motivated. Whether for short term exploitation or attempt to assert a longer relationship, (or reinforce one in the same of marital rape). The sadist motive you describe in wanting to make people cry can also be at least partial sexual. And of course motive can overlap.

It's dangerous to assume to know there's why clear recognizable TYPE of criminal (for any crime) because it might lead investigators to ignore potential suspects. At the same it would be a mistake to assume no one whose already offend would ever accept treatment and try to find a better outlet for their feelings.

Of course if it could be effect at treating some criminal even in the short run while they're still in custody that would probably be welcomed. The only question is who might be held accountable is they are deemed well enough for release and either regress or suffer long term unforeseen social consequences. Call it the Clockwork Orange problem.

[9ansean]

Interesting arguments.
Hmm, could using the holodeck as a baby sit be ethical.

The Star Trek holodeck that routinely kills people? No.

A perfected real life holodeck built to real life OSHA standards? Like most machines, It would probably do a better job than a human can. A fully caring babysitter who never tires, never gets drunk, never gets neglectful and knows first-aid perfectly. And its a holodeck, so it can take your kid to a version of Disneyland for the day where there is literally nothing that can harm him.

We sae in Once Upon a Time that with the right limitations and communication skills could not only be an effective babysitter, but a good learning tool for children as well.

[Darth Wedgius]

If holodeck behavior (whether it be pedophilia, rape, murder, or overdue library books) could demonstrably reduce real suffering, I'd be in favor of it. My discomfort at it happening wouldn't override the reduced trauma from such behavior in RL. It wouldn't be worse, IMHO, than someone writing a story about it.

If someone did use my image for a rape / murder simulation, I'd be uncomfortable but I think not hugely so. As long as I can get paid a licensing fee for any commercial use, anyway.

[Yukaphile]

Well, to some, they might think it should stop it completely, so if it does not, they'd probably then get emotional thinking that those doing so are exploiting it when they should stop since it's a "all-for-one" approach.

[Yukaphile]

How about unusual VR simulations? Like... vore? I mean, I say that as somebody into that paraphelia, and yet I'd be hesitant experiencing it in VR even among a programmable world with safeties.

[Thebestoftherest]

Interesting arguments.
Hmm, could using the holodeck as a baby sit be ethical.

The Star Trek holodeck that routinely kills people? No.

A perfected real life holodeck built to real life OSHA standards? Like most machines, It would probably do a better job than a human can. A fully caring babysitter who never tires, never gets drunk, never gets neglectful and knows first-aid perfectly. And its a holodeck, so it can take your kid to a version of Disneyland for the day where there is literally nothing that can harm him.

We sae in Once Upon a Time that with the right limitations and communication skills could not only be an effective babysitter, but a good learning tool for children as well.

It could work as a twenty four seven teacher, since something I found weird is every race in Star Trek docturnal?

[clearspira]

Interesting arguments.
Hmm, could using the holodeck as a baby sit be ethical.

The Star Trek holodeck that routinely kills people? No.

A perfected real life holodeck built to real life OSHA standards? Like most machines, It would probably do a better job than a human can. A fully caring babysitter who never tires, never gets drunk, never gets neglectful and knows first-aid perfectly. And its a holodeck, so it can take your kid to a version of Disneyland for the day where there is literally nothing that can harm him.

We sae in Once Upon a Time that with the right limitations and communication skills could not only be an effective babysitter, but a good learning tool for children as well.

It could work as a twenty four seven teacher, since something I found weird is every race in Star Trek docturnal?

Star Trek races are just humans with bumpy heads and the odd magical ability. They all sleep when we do, they all have males and females, they all have a nudity taboo, they all eat the same things and drink the same things, the same medicine works on everyone, they can mostly all reproduce with each other, they all like the same entertainment, they can all catch the same diseases.

True aliens are so God damn rare in Trek. Species 8472, the Tholians and any Godlike alien they meet are really what it is limited to. Say what you like about Star Wars or Farscape but the alien diversity on offer is at a different level.

[Yukaphile]

Animorphs existed to deliberately SUBVERT this trope and all other popular genre conventions.

[TGLS]

Okay what if a pedophile use one for his or her desires, would that be ethical.

Well, here's the rub. Most arguments against child pornography can be used against simulated child pornography, with the exception of the argument that the production of which is harmful and the people depicted within cannot be harmed (some people in child pornography have stated that when they hear about people viewing the content they are in, it causes emotional distress). Besides that, it a few jurisdictions, simulated child pornography is illegal and therefore this would too. Of course, what is illegal is not always what is immoral or socially unacceptable.

Anyway, wouldn't this be a better fit for the Sci-fi & Fantasy forum instead of Video Reviews?