Holier-than-thou virtue-signaling on the left?

[CmdrKing]

Put another way, allegations of sexual misconduct should by default be taken seriously and investigated with all due diligence, rather than dismissed out of hand.

[Yukaphile]

Yes, indeed. But in my case, I've found myself questioning accounts, that were never formally resolved or brought to court, that make me doubt, if they really happened, then if the victim was being sincere or lying. And in that case, it muddies things.

Another form of what I consider virtue-signaling. This would be moral absolutism, which really only applies in the areas where things are at the far fringes of black and white. Life is usually somewhere in between that. Usually.

[Darth Wedgius]

The virtue-signaling from the left I can usually just roll my eyes at and forget shortly thereafter. It's only when they go racist and sexist do I really object.

[Yukaphile]

Like their actions in 2016. I hear ya.

[Riedquat]

I mean, world is actually better than the 1950s, and we were riding high off the money we raked in from WWII then. Is it the 1990s? Nope. But then, what could be? The Internet would have killed it anyway.

All depends what you like in the world, and where you are in it. Some things improved as others declined, and where that balanced out as best varies from individual to individual (it certainly doesn't work out as "now" for me, and almost every vision of the future, including the supposedly positive ones, fill me with gloom).

[Yukaphile]

Absolutely true. While we were riding high in the 1990s, Russia had a famine, courtesy of Yeltsin. And then Bush's illegal invasions destabilized the Middle East. It is true. That said, statistically, in the US at least, despite mass shootings, crime IS going down. I think if we don't make things worse, it'll only get better. I thank the Internet for both suppressing and encouraging it.

[Riedquat]

Like I said it all depends upon what you like. Whilst I like high tech for entertainment I really, really hate the way it's insinuating itself into everyday life everywhere, and that's certainly not going to get better. I find the whole atmosphere of life changing in a way I find immensely unappealing, the whole look and feel of my surroundings getting more and more depressing - whilst it's hardly been trashed there are always things poking out that get me down, more and more of them, every modern-ish building, main road, tall mast etc. Local shops and facilities vanishing, always a move to rub the rough corners off the world but somehow kill its soul in the process. All done with the best of motivations (well, usually), but the results - no. I have no hope for the future, just a continual change towards a world that rubs me ever more raw. I wouldn't want to be a Victorian factory worker or medieval peasant but since all the material stuff I do need has been around since before I was born little "progress" since then does anything for me.

[Yukaphile]

I know another form of virtue-signaling.

[AllanO]

Personally I do not like the superfluous redundancy of saying "holier-than-thou virtue signaling" it is unneeded and excessive. Also people flaunting there erudition by harping on pedantic issues of style, grammar and so on, it is meaningless trivia and focusing on it just suggests ones own desperate need to show yourself as better than others by highlighting the least important details.

With all that out of the way. holier-than-thou already means flaunting your supposed moral superiority, so signaling your virtue. Paying lip service already means espousing principles you don't actually do anything to back up, again giving outward signs of a virtue (that you probably do not have). Tokenism implies doing only some bare visible minimum to back up some virtuous principle you claim deep commitment to and so on. These are all really good words and phrase, not clear what virtue signalling brings to the party.

For example, calling out virtue signalling is clearly a form of virtue signaling because it is saying "look how honest and forthright I am calling out other peoples BS" it is signalling a supposed virtue you have, so it strikes me as an exercise in paying lip service to some principle of modesty or the like. Yet to me people who say it, say it as if people with the right sorts of virtues they are not guilty of like actions. So my attitude prejudices me against people who use the term.

My attitude is somewhat unfair, especially as I no doubt act holier-than-thou, engage in tokenism and pay lip service to all sorts of high principles that I fail to live up to, but as long as we are having a thread where we just complain about things why not admit it.

[Darth Wedgius]

For example, calling out virtue signalling is clearly a form of virtue signaling because it is saying "look how honest and forthright I am calling out other peoples BS" it is signalling a supposed virtue you have, so it strikes me as an exercise in paying lip service to some principle of modesty or the like. Yet to me people who say it, say it as if people with the right sorts of virtues they are not guilty of like actions. So my attitude prejudices me against people who use the term.

Not so. Calling out virtue signalling isn't signalling one's own virtue any more than calling out a thief is a protestation of one's honestly. There is no logical implication of either involved.