Most prophetic movie of the 1990s?

[clearspira]

Demolition Man

That's my vote too.

[Darth Wedgius]

To be fair PCU has two flaws that makes it not entirely prophetic:

1) Frat Houses aren't completely banned, or the trope of Frat House rape would have disappeared.

2) Reality's political correctness is far more bottom-up than top-down, so the finale is much less probable.

Oh, there are definitely differences between PCU and the present.

[Beastro]

or fascist society.

What fascist society?

That's the hilarious thing about the movie. That was Verhoeven's intention (after he decided to not even bother finishing the book), yet the source material shines through leaving the only thing fascist being the aping of WWII era German uniforms and Leni Riefenstahl.

The Federation in both the book and movie are Libertarian paradise anchored by personal responsibility. The biggest highlight of this in the movie is Rico arguing with his father where Rico is the one wanting to actively take part in society and help out while his father is trying to convince him to ignore that and just get himself involved in business to make money.

A technological power suffers a devastating attack from a less advanced one, launches what they're sure will be a quickly resolved war, and instead gets dragged into an unwinnable quagmire in the desert.

Except the conflict isn't framed by technology being the decider of what makes which side powerful. The bugs were created to be both completely alien to human understanding (and vice versa) and be the ultimate collectivist civilization.

It doesn't matter how powerful Mankind is, the bugs have both the numbers and willingness to expend themselves in enormous quantities and still come out the victor.

The only thing the movie changed was making mankind more expendable by removing the power armour which made the Mobile Infantry, mobile in an attempt to try to turn the conflict into a mutual bloodbath for reason which don't conflict with the overall plot of both the book and the movie (Mankind being stuck in an existential war with an alien species who is only concerned with wiping them out given their alien point of view).

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

or fascist society.

The Federation in both the book and movie are Libertarian paradise anchored by personal responsibility. The biggest highlight of this in the movie is Rico arguing with his father where Rico is the one wanting to actively take part in society and help out while his father is trying to convince him to ignore that and just get himself involved in business to make money.

Well it really depends on the context. Needless to say, the viewer sees this construct from the perspective of a more open democracy via a civil republic. So while you can view the political circumstance in isolation and say, "well yeah if you run an institution with those types of rules set up, then that's legit," but insinuating a military dictatorship is such a brash directioning from a civil republic that you're effectively watching a seemingly rational take on a functioning Fascist state. Along with that, the precise focus on 1940's style propaganda echoing modernly recognized overtones as heavily racist and demeaning of people is used pretty consciously.

[Beastro]

Well it really depends on the context. Needless to say, the viewer sees this construct from the perspective of a more open democracy via a civil republic. So while you can view the political circumstance in isolation and say, "well yeah if you run an institution with those types of rules set up, then that's legit," but insinuating a military dictatorship is such a brash directioning from a civil republic that you're effectively watching a seemingly rational take on a functioning Fascist state. Along with that, the precise focus on 1940's style propaganda echoing modernly recognized overtones as heavily racist and demeaning of people is used pretty consciously.

Nothing within the movie itself frames the Federation as a dictatorship, and it's funny because you'd think he'd have altered things to make that very overtly clear. Even when it comes to the propaganda clips, they are openly honest in details black propaganda isn't (being that truthful is the antitheses of black propaganda). The Federation in the movie openly acknowledges the set backs and mistakes they've made in the war, showing the replacement of the wars main military leader within such a clip and there is nothing incongruous between what we see of Rico's time in civilian life before he signs up and those clips.

All that still boils down to "Verhoeven wanted to make it seem like it's fascist when the details say otherwise... so it's fascist" with a bit of "All propaganda is bad, so the movie aping Why we Fight in its clips shows that they're bad for releasing honest propaganda".

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Well it really depends on the context. Needless to say, the viewer sees this construct from the perspective of a more open democracy via a civil republic. So while you can view the political circumstance in isolation and say, "well yeah if you run an institution with those types of rules set up, then that's legit," but insinuating a military dictatorship is such a brash directioning from a civil republic that you're effectively watching a seemingly rational take on a functioning Fascist state. Along with that, the precise focus on 1940's style propaganda echoing modernly recognized overtones as heavily racist and demeaning of people is used pretty consciously.

Nothing within the movie itself frames the Federation as a dictatorship, and it's funny because you'd think he'd have altered things to make that very overtly clear. Even when it comes to the propaganda clips, they are openly honest in details black propaganda isn't (being that truthful is the antitheses of black propaganda). The Federation in the movie openly acknowledges the set backs and mistakes they've made in the war, showing the replacement of the wars main military leader within such a clip and there is nothing incongruous between what we see of Rico's time in civilian life before he signs up and those clips.

All that still boils down to "Verhoeven wanted to make it seem like it's fascist when the details say otherwise... so it's fascist" with a bit of "All propaganda is bad, so the movie aping Why we Fight in its clips shows that they're bad for releasing honest propaganda".

I can see if you're making a case that the book goes for a more draconian setting (I'm not familiar with the book myself, mind you). But for what we do actually see in the movie, the signs are there and are rather overt, as I was saying in the last post, and perhaps they are too much in order to make it more obvious. Checking the wikipedia for the Terran Federation (as depicted in the book), the movie version, United Citizen Federation, is described in contrast:

In the film adaptation, the United Citizen Federation (UCF) was used in place of the Terran Federation and has many of the hallmarks of a fascist government, including heavy-handed propaganda, the demonization of an external foe, the centralized organization of society for total war, military (or militarized) and not civilian leadership, and omnipresent uniforms.

The formation of the UCF is not fully explained in the movie. However, dialogue at the beginning of the film suggests its formation was similar to the Terran Federation (albeit more bloody).

Like in the novel, in order to vote in the UCF one must provide "Federal Service" by serving in the military or other service. The social structure of the world is, just like the Terran Federation, divided between citizens (people who have served) and civilians (people who haven't served).

[Yukaphile]

"Enemy of State" seems scarily relevant today, with government outreach versus the clear needs for security and intelligence-gathering, like what Chuck had discussed in his review of "Shadows of P'Jem." Though I maintain that Bush wasn't "misinformed," so much as ignored all warnings so they'd have justification to invade these countries. 9/11 "truth," though, is pure fantasy.

[Yukaphile]

Oh, fun fact. The main antagonist in "Enemy of the State" was born on 9/11. You can't make this shit up, haha.

[Rocketboy1313]

What fascist society?

In his 1995 essay, "Ur Fascism" the writer Umberto Eco developed a list of 14 common features of Fascism. A Fascist regime does not have to have all 14.
Some of the criteria conflict with one another in subtle ways, and some encapsulate a paradox (Kind of like Double Think from "1984").
This is not the only way to define fascism, but I find it to be useful.
Here is a link to where I got the list.
http://www.openculture.com/2016/11/umberto-eco-makes-a-list-of-the-14-common-features-of-fascism.html

I will limit my discussion to the move, because even tho I have read the book,
Link to my blog review of the audio book: https://rocketboy1313.blogspot.com/2017/05/audible-review-starship-troopers.html
I do not have a print copy and am too busy to write a full on book report for the purposes of a web board discussion. I am going to go with my best recollection of the movie for this.

1) The cult of tradition. “One has only to look at the syllabus of every fascist movement to find the major traditionalist thinkers. The Nazi gnosis was nourished by traditionalist, syncretistic, occult elements.”
No. I don't think this criteria is met by what we see in the movie.

2) The rejection of modernism. “The Enlightenment, the Age of Reason, is seen as the beginning of modern depravity. In this sense Ur-Fascism can be defined as irrationalism.”
Borderline. Carmen brings up the value of art and the humanities while they are dissecting the bug and it is mostly dismissed. And Michael Ironside during a civics course seems more than a little dismissive of societies that did not put military preparedness at the core of their governing philosophies.

3) The cult of action for action’s sake. “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.”
Borderline. The rush to land and strike back at the bugs after Buenos Aires is close... But the fact that its failure results in a more thoughtful approach is a rebuff.

4) Disagreement is treason. “The critical spirit makes distinctions, and to distinguish is a sign of modernism. In modern culture the scientific community praises disagreement as a way to improve knowledge.”
No. I don't think we see enough of society to make a determination on this. But I would say no.

5) Fear of difference. “The first appeal of a fascist or prematurely fascist movement is an appeal against the intruders. Thus Ur-Fascism is racist by definition.”
Borderline. "The only good bug is a dead bug!" "A Bug that thinks!? Frankly I'm insulted!"
The reason this one is more difficult is that when the opposition is LITERALLY an alien menace rather than a racist caricature... well... The metaphor is not perfect.

6) Appeal to social frustration. “One of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups.”
No. This one doesn't fit because we are not seeing the RISE of a fascist society, but one that has attained a world wide government. How it came to power, "The Veterans took control" is a little vague.

7) The obsession with a plot. “The followers must feel besieged. The easiest way to solve the plot is the appeal to xenophobia.”
Borderline. Again, when there is a LITERAL ALIEN MENACE...

8) The enemy is both strong and weak. “By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
Yes. I find this to be on the mark. There is a shifting of how bugs are portrayed as a distant primitive violent menace, to easily stomped on by children, to an up close menace, to one that is insidious.

9) Pacifism is trafficking with the enemy. “For Ur-Fascism there is no struggle for life but, rather, life is lived for struggle.”
No. Pacifism is unmentioned in the movie.

10) Contempt for the weak. “Elitism is a typical aspect of any reactionary ideology.”
No. I don't recall this being an element of the story. The one general get punched in the face by Ironside for losing his shit, but that is not a real example.

11) Everybody is educated to become a hero. “In Ur-Fascist ideology, heroism is the norm. This cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.”
Yes. "I'm doing my part!" Yeah, this is here.

12) Machismo and weaponry. “Machismo implies both disdain for women and intolerance and condemnation of nonstandard sexual habits, from chastity to homosexuality.”
Borderline. The weaponry is definitely present (and isn't completely explained in the select quote), but there isn't any overt sexism and I don't think there is any mention of non-straights non-cis citizens anywhere. I would again say borderline.

13) Selective populism. “There is in our future a TV or Internet populism, in which the emotional response of a selected group of citizens can be presented and accepted as the Voice of the People.”
Yes. I will say this is definitely present. The "Would you like to know more" is representative of a rather tightly controlled narrative for the media.

14) Ur-Fascism speaks Newspeak. “All the Nazi or Fascist schoolbooks made use of an impoverished vocabulary, and an elementary syntax, in order to limit the instruments for complex and critical reasoning.”
Borderline. I cannot think of a character in the movie that uses any complex wording or makes mention of any complex readings. The dialogue is all easy to understand, and often kind of brain dead. Again, the movie is not a comprehensive view of the world so it might be there or it might not.

I would say of the criteria we have,
Not present: 5
Borderline: 6
Present: 3

I would say that it is not, demonstrably a fascist society.
HOWEVER, I would not say that it is Libertarian either.
It is definitely authoritarian. It is definitely a military Junta.
There is no civilian leadership present in the movie.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Oh, fun fact. The main antagonist in "Enemy of the State" was born on 9/11. You can't make this shit up, haha.

He's also Angelina Jolie's dad.