Voyager - Favorite Son

[Artabax]

Another point: the Turisians presumably didn't start as an interstellar species, so how did they reproduce before they were able to pull off their alien abduction gambit?
Once upon a time, there were Turisian men. Then there was a spatial anomaly Phlox and Archer visited. Phlox modified a plague bacillus to kill all the men and thought "Job done!"

[clearspira]

I'm not even sure why the alien Vamazons needed to go full on praying mantis on their mates. It doesn't seem to be nourishment for the women or their babies, they say "genetic material" which presumably means the stuff down below or possibly blood judging from how the other guy was looking like a actual vampire victim. Doesn't make sense to me atleast, either way its a renewable resource that I'm sure you can find ways of increasing "yield". You don't kill a cow to get its milk, these aliens shouldn't kill a dude to get his "genetic material". Heck without the threat of death I'm betting quite a few guys would volunteer and would probably solve the problem, seems like beef jerky was supposed to married to multiple women, maybe having more men around means you don't have to "squeeze the orange dry" so to speak.

A non-trivial number of writers have this problem where they don't understand how easily replicable genetic material is. You see this in X-COM 2. One of the most facepalming parts of a narrative that involves human guerillas defeating interstellar warlords through a series of 6-man squad actions is when it's revealed where the aliens are getting their soldiers: they gather together a bunch of humans, melt them down into "concentrated human genetic material" and then use the resulting sludge to 3d-print minions. Never mind the fact that you could easily siphon off a good chunk of the blood supply for this purpose, but we can duplicate DNA quickly and (relatively) cheaply today.

I'm suddenly reminded of golden rice, a GM crop that could literally save tens of thousands of lives in the third world but keeps on getting blocked by people who have ''loving'' reputations like Greenpeace. Why? Because GM crops are SCARY. And that is before we even get into the colossal medical benefits that we can already perform with stem cells, cloning and genetic engineering but are being blocked from doing so. Unlimited organs, cures to currently incurable diseases, the end to the genetic lottery etc.

Where am I going with this? Because if we can live in a world where a simple bowl of modified rice can cause so much controversy that people are willing to let children waste away from starvation, I can absolutely see someone justifying only using ''real'' men to reproduce with as opposed to ''artificial'' men created using all of that SCARY science.

And yeah, I am being facetious. But I am tired of living in a farcical world that would rather children die than distribute our version of quadrotriticale.

[CrypticMirror]

I'm suddenly reminded of golden rice, a GM crop that could literally save tens of thousands of lives in the third world but keeps on getting blocked by people who have ''loving'' reputations like Greenpeace. Why? Because GM crops are SCARY.

That is the FOX news version. The real reason is it was because the corporations behind it have a less than stellar reputation for long term risk assessment and basic safety. When we're dealing with things which had the potential to threaten the entire ecosystem if risk assessments and long term safety trials were not run with an incredibly high level of rigorousness, then a high degree of scepticism and caution is warranted. Rice is a grain, grains make up the staple food for most of the human population on the planet, for something that, in the worst case scenario, could literally, not figuratively but literally, be apocalyptic we needed to make sure that the science was beyond reproach before letting them loose in the wild. And the reputation of a lot of the agricultural corporations was far from meeting that standard.

People were saying that GM crops were scary, because they really did have the potential to be very scary indeed, and the corporation behind them had done very little to engender trust. Arguably they still haven't, just they've used political donations and contacts within the media to brute force their way forward. It is hard to trust the untrustworthy, and rushing products to market without proper research has a high chance of hurting the end user even when the product is not the very literal thing we need to live. Do not confuse people asking that the science be done stringently and that the results be auditable for superstition or unreasoning terror.

[clearspira]

I'm suddenly reminded of golden rice, a GM crop that could literally save tens of thousands of lives in the third world but keeps on getting blocked by people who have ''loving'' reputations like Greenpeace. Why? Because GM crops are SCARY.

That is the FOX news version. The real reason is it was because the corporations behind it have a less than stellar reputation for long term risk assessment and basic safety. When we're dealing with things which had the potential to threaten the entire ecosystem if risk assessments and long term safety trials were not run with an incredibly high level of rigorousness, then a high degree of scepticism and caution is warranted. Rice is a grain, grains make up the staple food for most of the human population on the planet, for something that, in the worst case scenario, could literally, not figuratively but literally, be apocalyptic we needed to make sure that the science was beyond reproach before letting them loose in the wild. And the reputation of a lot of the agricultural corporations was far from meeting that standard.

People were saying that GM crops were scary, because they really did have the potential to be very scary indeed, and the corporation behind them had done very little to engender trust. Arguably they still haven't, just they've used political donations and contacts within the media to brute force their way forward. It is hard to trust the untrustworthy, and rushing products to market without proper research has a high chance of hurting the end user even when the product is not the very literal thing we need to live. Do not confuse people asking that the science be done stringently and that the results be auditable for superstition or unreasoning terror.

I was under the impression it was tested and ready to go. Fair enough.
Although I still think that human beings have an irrational fear of ''playing God''. Now, I am cynical as Hell so I do not trust governments with the power one bit, but there is a lot of good that we can be doing with benign versions of our tech right now and yet we aren't.

[CrypticMirror]

I'm suddenly reminded of golden rice, a GM crop that could literally save tens of thousands of lives in the third world but keeps on getting blocked by people who have ''loving'' reputations like Greenpeace. Why? Because GM crops are SCARY.

That is the FOX news version. The real reason is it was because the corporations behind it have a less than stellar reputation for long term risk assessment and basic safety. When we're dealing with things which had the potential to threaten the entire ecosystem if risk assessments and long term safety trials were not run with an incredibly high level of rigorousness, then a high degree of scepticism and caution is warranted. Rice is a grain, grains make up the staple food for most of the human population on the planet, for something that, in the worst case scenario, could literally, not figuratively but literally, be apocalyptic we needed to make sure that the science was beyond reproach before letting them loose in the wild. And the reputation of a lot of the agricultural corporations was far from meeting that standard.

People were saying that GM crops were scary, because they really did have the potential to be very scary indeed, and the corporation behind them had done very little to engender trust. Arguably they still haven't, just they've used political donations and contacts within the media to brute force their way forward. It is hard to trust the untrustworthy, and rushing products to market without proper research has a high chance of hurting the end user even when the product is not the very literal thing we need to live. Do not confuse people asking that the science be done stringently and that the results be auditable for superstition or unreasoning terror.

I was under the impression it was tested and ready to go. Fair enough.

That is what is under dispute. But getting information out of the agricultural corporations is like pulling teeth, and that really isn't helping their case. The lack of openness and transparency makes it really hard to trust them that the thing, should it go wrong, which has the potential to create a famine the like of which history has never seen, is trustworthy. Exceptional consequences require exceptional safety standards, and the information to ensure that that those safeguards are in place is not fully in the public domain.

Edit: I'm not going to say that nobody was objecting to GM crops just out of uninformed fear or blind ideology, although I truly wish I could but we live in a world which has antivaxxers in it soooo.... But there were and are real scientific, credibly scientific, questions which are still -at best- only tenuously answered. Rice is an exceptional case here, which is why it is such a cause celebre on both sides of the debate because it is such a visible staple and because the consequences of inaction can be clearly seen but the consequences of ill considered action are not so visible but potentially far more deadly on a far greater scale if we screw up badly enough.

[Deledrius]

I'm suddenly reminded of golden rice, a GM crop that could literally save tens of thousands of lives in the third world but keeps on getting blocked by people who have ''loving'' reputations like Greenpeace. Why? Because GM crops are SCARY. And that is before we even get into the colossal medical benefits that we can already perform with stem cells, cloning and genetic engineering but are being blocked from doing so. Unlimited organs, cures to currently incurable diseases, the end to the genetic lottery etc.

Where am I going with this? Because if we can live in a world where a simple bowl of modified rice can cause so much controversy that people are willing to let children waste away from starvation, I can absolutely see someone justifying only using ''real'' men to reproduce with as opposed to ''artificial'' men created using all of that SCARY science.

And yeah, I am being facetious. But I am tired of living in a farcical world that would rather children die than distribute our version of quadrotriticale.

It's very frustrating, because this particular crop manages to avoid nearly all of the criticisms levied against such things. It's not corporately-controlled, it's open, it's free, it's been well-studied, and it provides an immediate benefit in an existing crop the target farms are already growing and know how to manage. It's been approved by the regulatory bodies in the US, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand.

The fear-mongering and misunderstandings while people are dying of malnourishment is depressing.

I was under the impression it was tested and ready to go. Fair enough.

It is.

[TGLS]

I'm not even sure why the alien Vamazons needed to go full on praying mantis on their mates. It doesn't seem to be nourishment for the women or their babies, they say "genetic material" which presumably means the stuff down below or possibly blood judging from how the other guy was looking like a actual vampire victim. Doesn't make sense to me atleast, either way its a renewable resource that I'm sure you can find ways of increasing "yield". You don't kill a cow to get its milk, these aliens shouldn't kill a dude to get his "genetic material". Heck without the threat of death I'm betting quite a few guys would volunteer and would probably solve the problem, seems like beef jerky was supposed to married to multiple women, maybe having more men around means you don't have to "squeeze the orange dry" so to speak.

A non-trivial number of writers have this problem where they don't understand how easily replicable genetic material is. You see this in X-COM 2. One of the most facepalming parts of a narrative that involves human guerillas defeating interstellar warlords through a series of 6-man squad actions is when it's revealed where the aliens are getting their soldiers: they gather together a bunch of humans, melt them down into "concentrated human genetic material" and then use the resulting sludge to 3d-print minions. Never mind the fact that you could easily siphon off a good chunk of the blood supply for this purpose, but we can duplicate DNA quickly and (relatively) cheaply today.

I'm suddenly reminded of golden rice, a GM crop that could literally save tens of thousands of lives in the third world but keeps on getting blocked by people who have ''loving'' reputations like Greenpeace.

To be perfectly fair with golden rice, there has been debate whether or not there's sufficient beta-carotene in the rice to say whether it is a source of vitamin A, and whether it would last long enough the way they store rice before use. The US FDA has determined it hasn't, other studies have determined it has, and you could still just resolve the same problem by teaching locals to grow and eat carrots or something.

[Deledrius]

whether it is a source of vitamin A, and whether it would last long enough the way they store rice before use. The US FDA has determined it hasn't

To my understanding, the FDA determined that the amount was insignificant in a typical American diet where there are plentiful and numerous sources. The amounts compared to the typical diet in the regions this is being targeted at is a substantial improvement, enough to prevent many Vitamin-A-deficiency-related harms.

That's an important distinction, and it's easy to overlook or misreport, but it's a pretty crucial detail when talking about efficacy.

you could still just resolve the same problem by teaching locals to grow and eat carrots or something.

That's not a strong argument.

Which is easier in areas where Vitamin A deficiency is a life-threatening problem?

Providing free seeds which act as a drop-in replacement for existing crops, or teaching whole new methods of farming and new crops which require potentially different kinds of land, equipment, and resources, as well as the infrastructure changes required to transport and store carrots instead of rice?

Ideally, both solutions are part of a larger strategy of problem-solving. One of them can be implemented with immediate effect, however.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

All this talk about golden rice is makin' me hungry.

[Deledrius]

All this talk about golden rice is makin' me hungry.

That was some tangent.

Though, in the end, Harry Kim is less interesting than the crazy things which happen to his DNA.