Moderates don't Exist.

[MithrandirOlorin]

My Point is that Obama was as far to the left as was viable in 2008. And compared to how McCain was perceived by his own party it was definetly the Dems who want radical.

[MithrandirOlorin]

But like the Centrists of Weimar Germany if push comes to shove they will deem the far right the lesser evil because at least their insanity is amenable to Capitalism.

Well, sure.

The Nazis say "We're going to take away your freedom of expression. We'll burn your books and regulate your art. We're going to raise your children as robots of the state, and we'll probably have to kill a lot of your fellow citizens. It's terribly unfortunate but it's the only way to ensure a better tomorrow."

The Communists say "We're going to take away your freedom of expression. We'll burn your books and regulate your art. We're going to raise your children as robots of the state, and we'll probably have to kill a lot of your fellow citizens. It's terribly unfortunate but it's the only way to ensure a better tomorrow. Oh, and we're going to have to take all your stuff."

It's that last bit that's the kicker.

The Communists were saying none of those things.

[Yukaphile]

Well, they did indeed do just that at the end.

I am wondering what happens if Biden does steal the nomination this year, however. I think the constant way he sticks his foot in his mouth is embarrassing, and his frankly old-fashioned views that have no place in a party that claims diversity, yet seems to be narrowing the focus on older white males. I hear even Obama wondered WHY Biden is doing this. If anything, I think he'd alienate way too many key voting groups to make it. But who knows? These are sure weird times where the center right dude with the tokenist views seems to be the Democratic favorite... like an inverted Trump.

[Yukaphile]

For reference, Biden is perceived as a moderate, hence me bringing that up.

[MithrandirOlorin]

Yes Biden is the most "moderate" in this Primary, he'd be the equivalent to nominating Hilary of Kerry again.

But in the context of Running agaisnt Trump, only Sander or Yang is truly outside the box enough to appeal to the same rust belt voters who Trump got in 2016, and then many more.

[LittleRaven]

But in the context of Running agaisnt Trump, only Sander or Yang is truly outside the box enough to appeal to the same rust belt voters who Trump got in 2016, and then many more.

That might be true, but you have to win the nomination before you get a shot at the Presidency. And right now, both Yang and Sanders have a HUGE problem - black people don't like em.

https://www.politico.com/news/2019/12/13/poll-biden-continues-to-dominate-among-black-voters-084285

Black voters are a HUGE block for the Democrats. Lock them down and you're 80% of the way to the nomination. That's how Obama beat Hillary, and it's how Hillary beat Sanders last time. And right now, Biden appears to have them on lockdown. He's 29 points ahead of the next contender. History suggests that kind of a lead is almost impossible to overcome, though if we learned anything from 2016 it's that there's always a first time.

[Yukaphile]

Sanders would lose every other demographic. ALL of them. You people seriously do not know about the skeletons in his closet that would make people less inclined to vote for him.

He'd carry the Rust Belt, sure. But virtually many other states, even traditionally blue ones, that are needed. Mostly from city voters, which are increasingly diverse.

I just find it so damned stupid that the party which is so damned insistent on diversity is nominating an older white man. That blacks want this asshole to leave as his legacy just HANDING the White House to a black woman. My God, that's such benevolent sexism, I can't even fathom it... it suggests to me they feel Trump is literally crossing a line, and we must beat him at ALL costs, thus... let's weaponize the very white privilege we hate! And this is why Democrats are just as much hypocrites as the GOP.

[Yukaphile]

My God, can't you people see it?! How questionable that is?! It's cheating women out of winning the White House fairly! And it's having a BLACK WOMAN serve under a white man... it just feels all WRONG.

[Yukaphile]

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/women-rule/2019/03/22/the-3-bs-want-women-veeps-is-that-condescending-414245

I see this patronizing bullshit for what it is! I SAW THIS COMING IN 2016! It's why I just gave up voting. Completely. And if we're okay with that as a country, I AM NOT. I would rather Trump wins. No joke.

[LittleRaven]

Ease up there, Yuka. There's like 20 of us here - and half of us aren't even eligible to vote in the US. This ship is bigger than any of us.

As for floating a female VP - VPs get picked for all kinds of reasons, and it's usually not patronizing. Kerry was not patronizing Edwards when he picked him for VP - he recognized that Edwards had skills and support that his campaign could utilize. It was a mutual alliance between former adversaries, which happen CONSTANTLY in politics. McCain was not patronizing Palin when he picked her, though picking her was a spectacularly bad decision for all kinds of other reasons. It was a Hail Mary Pass at the end of the forth quarter for a dying campaign.