I don't think I ever connected the events of The Cutie Re-Mark to the end of The Friendship Games before. Of course, I only ever watched TFG the one time, and quite a while after the end of season 5. So I didn't quite have it in mind at the time. I'm just not the biggest fan of the Equestria Girls spin off material.
I have several Brony friends who absolutely loath Starlight Glimmer as a character. They maybe liked her as a villain in The Cutie Map, but they wanted to see her thoroughly defeat and punished. They did not like her being made a series regular. Any episode where she had more than a minute of screen time was bad. Took them years to warm up to her even a little bit, and then only when she was repeatedly paired up with Trixie, a character they did like. Me, I won't say I loved every single episode she was featured in, but I did like her overall arc.
Like I said above, I wasn't overly fond of Equestria Girls. I didn't hate them, but I didn't love them either. The first one in particular I thought was rather weak, because I found Sunset Shimmer to be a completely ineffective villain. She stole Twilight's crown, then basically did nothing but be a high school bully stereotype for 90% of the movie, then was defeated by a weaponized friendship beam that came out of no where. But I did think she was better in the sequels as a reformed heroine. I've always been fond of former villains becoming heroes. This goes all the way back to Return of the Jedi for me. I was 3 when that movie came out, and Darth Vader's final redemption has always stuck with me.
So when Starlight Glimmer appeared in The Cutie Map, it was obvious to me just what she was. Sunset Shimmer 2.0. Only this time, she was done much more effectively as a villain. By force of personality, she turned that village into her little communist cult, and by force of raw magic, was a threat even to Alicorn Twilight. And this time, there was no weaponized friendship beam to force her to the light side. Twilight had to appeal to her heart and mind.Like the title of the show says, Friendship is Magic.
Also, becoming a mentor figure was really the only way forward with Twilight's character.
So yeah, I'm fond of these episodes. The former pair for introducing an effective villain to later reform, and the latter because I like a good time travel story where the past is screwed up, and the hero must set things right.
MLP Lincoln's Day (?) Show
-
Darth Wedgius
- Captain
- Posts: 2948
- Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:43 pm
Re: MLP Lincoln's Day (?) Show
Ah, Starlight, Starlight...
Both as a villain and a reformed hero, I like her. As a villain, she's scary not for the raw power she wields (though it does help) but the personality and the means. She uses actual cult indoctrination techniques, convinces a whole host of embittered ponies to drop what makes them them. There's something more unsettling in that than in any amount of reality bending that we'd seen so far.
As a reformed character she connected a lot more with me, an adult male who uses humour and sarcasm a lot, with her personality. Doubly so when she took up the position as guidance councillor, and had to deal with Trixie (her totally not girlfriend, just best friend, totally). The two of them had a great dynamic and the sort of couples-councilling issues that they went through were some very refreshingly adult problems.
The one thing I wasn't a fan of, as with many others it seems, is the transition between the two. Yes, she didn't know she was destroying the world as she knew it with the time travel shenanigans, but even ignoring that, there's a lot there that sort of gets swept under the rug, and while that may be a recurring issue in Equestria it's still frustrating. Still, by the end of the series she'd grown into one of my favourite characters, so it all worked out in the end.
Both as a villain and a reformed hero, I like her. As a villain, she's scary not for the raw power she wields (though it does help) but the personality and the means. She uses actual cult indoctrination techniques, convinces a whole host of embittered ponies to drop what makes them them. There's something more unsettling in that than in any amount of reality bending that we'd seen so far.
As a reformed character she connected a lot more with me, an adult male who uses humour and sarcasm a lot, with her personality. Doubly so when she took up the position as guidance councillor, and had to deal with Trixie (her totally not girlfriend, just best friend, totally). The two of them had a great dynamic and the sort of couples-councilling issues that they went through were some very refreshingly adult problems.
The one thing I wasn't a fan of, as with many others it seems, is the transition between the two. Yes, she didn't know she was destroying the world as she knew it with the time travel shenanigans, but even ignoring that, there's a lot there that sort of gets swept under the rug, and while that may be a recurring issue in Equestria it's still frustrating. Still, by the end of the series she'd grown into one of my favourite characters, so it all worked out in the end.
-
Darth Wedgius
- Captain
- Posts: 2948
- Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:43 pm
Re: MLP Lincoln's Day (?) Show
I liked Starlight Glimmer as a regular addition because it added something for Twilight to do and for her interactions with Spike (I felt she treated him more as an equal than a kid, which makes sense for a character feeling a lack of confidence), but especially for two reasons.
(1) Starlight and Trixie, friends that could banter with each other.
(2) Where and Back Again. She's been shown to rely overmuch on magic (something she's very talented at) and now, with the fate of Equestria at risk, she needs to rely on wit, friendship, and deus ex machina endings. I think that was the real end of her redemption arc.
(1) Starlight and Trixie, friends that could banter with each other.
(2) Where and Back Again. She's been shown to rely overmuch on magic (something she's very talented at) and now, with the fate of Equestria at risk, she needs to rely on wit, friendship, and deus ex machina endings. I think that was the real end of her redemption arc.
-
Thebestoftherest
- Captain
- Posts: 3748
- Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:22 pm
Re: MLP Lincoln's Day (?) Show
Why not.Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:42 pm So is Chuck gonna keep doing MLP specials for increasingly obscure holidays? A few years from now are we gonna tune in to the SFDebris Feast Day for the Patron Saint of Bulgar Wheat and South Cumbrian Cheesecloth Makers MLP Episode?
-
Dragon Ball Fan
- Captain
- Posts: 3160
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 10:40 pm
-
Dragon Ball Fan
- Captain
- Posts: 3160
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 10:40 pm
Re: MLP Lincoln's Day (?) Show
once more, people have said to just imagine punishments happening off screen but I can only think or ways to do that by changing the events of episodes in my head, the touchy feely all is forgiven tone seems to make that impossible to be compatible with any headcanon.
it is shown both in the comics and in the actual show that Equestria does have a semi realistic justice system, why is it never used? and I don't think Twilight has the power to pardon, she is actually of a lower rank authority wise then Celestia. they insist on calling all the royals princes or princesses but Twilight is more accurately a duchess until she becomes Celestia's successor.
it is shown both in the comics and in the actual show that Equestria does have a semi realistic justice system, why is it never used? and I don't think Twilight has the power to pardon, she is actually of a lower rank authority wise then Celestia. they insist on calling all the royals princes or princesses but Twilight is more accurately a duchess until she becomes Celestia's successor.
-
Dragon Ball Fan
- Captain
- Posts: 3160
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 10:40 pm
Re: MLP Lincoln's Day (?) Show
just because it worked for Darth Vader doesn't mean it works all the time. I have never really felt it work with any of the reformed villains, "friendship is magic" is not a good enough explanation for a face turn.
Re: MLP Lincoln's Day (?) Show
I was someone who really enjoyed Starlight as a villain in Season 5 (which I consider one of the show's best) and was interested to see how they'd handle her as a recurring regular in Season 6. The results were ... less than enthralling.
The biggest missteps with her were:
(1) giving us a dynamic where Twilight was obliviously dumping tremendous amounts of pressure on her, smiling as she did so, and despite recognizing in the FIRST episode of Season 6 that it was a mistake, they had them repeat that SAME formula in about a half-dozen other episodes. It's a cheap attempt to make us sympathize with Starlight by making Twilight look overbearing. If you can't make us like, relate to and empathize with a new character except by making an established one look worse, you should rethink things.
(2) alternating between making jokes about her past and being indignant that other ponies kept bringing up said past. Yes, seriously. In the same episode even.
(3) Using magic constantly to compel others to do what she wanted, both before AND after "Every Little Thing She Does"
(4) In said episode, she's still pondering why her spell didn't function properly and doesn't recognize or admit the sheer immorality of what she did until after Twilight spelled it out for her. That makes Starlight look pretty bad.
(5) Coupling this with far too many episodes where Twilight and the Mane Six appeared ineffective if not outright incompetent and the only one with the correct answer was Starlight herself. Plus having an ENTIRE episode all about how great she was and how she 'clearly' had 'outgrown' friendship lessons because she saved the day once--by which logic Twilight should've graduated with the defeat of Nightmare Moon, or Discord at the latest!
Obviously, I'm not saying Twilight can NEVER accidentally put too much pressure on Starlight or that Starlight should NEVER get a winning moment--but it happened far, far too much and coupled that with Starlight's repeatedly really poor decision making and it overall just made for a very uneven experience with a character I struggled to like. She got much MUCH better when she was working off other characters who weren't the Mane Six as it always felt a little forced with them. But pair her off with Sunburst or Maud or Trixie (outside of No Second Prances) and you were almost guaranteed to have a great episode.
Great Starlight appearances: Rocksolid Friendship, Parent Map, Uncommon Bond, On the Road to Friendship, Shadowplay, Triple Threat, Fame and Misfortune
Bad Starlight appearances: No Second Prances, Every Little Thing She Does, Celestial Advice, School Daze
The biggest missteps with her were:
(1) giving us a dynamic where Twilight was obliviously dumping tremendous amounts of pressure on her, smiling as she did so, and despite recognizing in the FIRST episode of Season 6 that it was a mistake, they had them repeat that SAME formula in about a half-dozen other episodes. It's a cheap attempt to make us sympathize with Starlight by making Twilight look overbearing. If you can't make us like, relate to and empathize with a new character except by making an established one look worse, you should rethink things.
(2) alternating between making jokes about her past and being indignant that other ponies kept bringing up said past. Yes, seriously. In the same episode even.
(3) Using magic constantly to compel others to do what she wanted, both before AND after "Every Little Thing She Does"
(4) In said episode, she's still pondering why her spell didn't function properly and doesn't recognize or admit the sheer immorality of what she did until after Twilight spelled it out for her. That makes Starlight look pretty bad.
(5) Coupling this with far too many episodes where Twilight and the Mane Six appeared ineffective if not outright incompetent and the only one with the correct answer was Starlight herself. Plus having an ENTIRE episode all about how great she was and how she 'clearly' had 'outgrown' friendship lessons because she saved the day once--by which logic Twilight should've graduated with the defeat of Nightmare Moon, or Discord at the latest!
Obviously, I'm not saying Twilight can NEVER accidentally put too much pressure on Starlight or that Starlight should NEVER get a winning moment--but it happened far, far too much and coupled that with Starlight's repeatedly really poor decision making and it overall just made for a very uneven experience with a character I struggled to like. She got much MUCH better when she was working off other characters who weren't the Mane Six as it always felt a little forced with them. But pair her off with Sunburst or Maud or Trixie (outside of No Second Prances) and you were almost guaranteed to have a great episode.
Great Starlight appearances: Rocksolid Friendship, Parent Map, Uncommon Bond, On the Road to Friendship, Shadowplay, Triple Threat, Fame and Misfortune
Bad Starlight appearances: No Second Prances, Every Little Thing She Does, Celestial Advice, School Daze
