The Paradox of Tolerance

[Antiboyscout]

a decent criteria for what qualifies Nazi behavior, such as, say, wearing the armbands, giving the Hitler salute, shouting any number of Nazi catchphrases,.

If I teach my pug to give the Hitler salute do I deserve to go to jail?

I have seen too many times where people call things racist when they are actively anti-racist. The most common target is 70's and 80's sitcoms where the satirizing of racism is now considered racism. Because saying the words is enough. Motivation be damned.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Is your Pug wearing an armband and calling for the death of Jews?

[Antiboyscout]

Do you not get the reference?

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... e-scotland

[Admiral X]

People seem to be having a really bizarre misunderstanding/misinterpretation of what tolerance is. Tolerance simply means the recognition that everyone has the same rights, and even if we don't like or agree with what others are saying, we recognize that they have a right to say it. Anything less is not free speech - popular speech does not need to be defended. It's like during the Bush years when the neo-cons insisted we needed to set aside civil liberties because "war on terrorism." The thing is, civil rights are not just civil rights when everything is hunky-dory. Since it's founding, this country has almost always been in some kind of a war or conflict. It's when things are shitty that civil rights are the most important, because it shows just how dedicated to this country's founding principles we really are. And the thing is, now the "progressives" have every bit as much of a brain fart as the neo-cons when it comes to this free speech issue, because they seem to be under the impression that letting these people make fools of themselves somehow translates in to "OMG the Nazis have taken over and can do whatever they want!" Uh, no, that isn't how that works. This is a nation of laws, and as much as they might say how much they'd love to do vile and nasty things, they can't. And yes, this does translate into the police "not doing anything and even actively helping them," and all because the other group of idiots keep trying to attack them. Tolerance does not mean support or acceptance.

And to the "doomed to repeat history crowd," part of what lead to the rise of the Nazis in Germany was the violence in the streets between them and communists. It allowed them to play the victim, and to play the "hero to the people" by protecting them from the communists. The anthem for the brown shirts, "Horst Wessel Lied" is actually about a member of the SA who was singled out and killed by members of the German Communist Party. And while I really doubt the Nazis will ever gain that kind of power here (and not for lack of trying, look up the Business Plot), it does still allow them to play the same victimhood game, and it'll probably lead to more restrictions on civil liberties thanks to all the assholes who think they're helping things by starting fights.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Yeah, the problem is that communists were opposing Nazis. I guess Vedic Yassim was full of shit huh?

[GandALF]

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/ ... ews-215488

[Admiral X]

Yeah, the problem is that communists were opposing Nazis. I guess Vedic Yassim was full of shit huh?

The problem was that the public began to see the communists as the greater threat, and that the Nazis sold themselves very well as the public's "protector."

[LittleRaven]

And to the "doomed to repeat history crowd," part of what lead to the rise of the Nazis in Germany was the violence in the streets between them and communists. It allowed them to play the victim, and to play the "hero to the people" by protecting them from the communists.

Yup. As popular a sentiment at it is on the internet, "punching a Nazi" helps his cause 99% of the time. Sure, during a torch march in Charlottesville it might be necessary, but it most certainly isn't necessary for a speech at Berkeley. The fact that the one followed the other is not a coincidence. The Nazi wants to be punched. Violence, regardless of the source, fuels his movement.

If you really want to hit the movement where it hurt, try laughing at them.

“Fascists, you need to understand, are the ultimate psychic vampires,” he writes. “They feed off hate. They want to stoke it as much as possible. They want things to become as violent as possible. They love it when you become violent, and give them martyrs …”

...

Example: In 2005 the National Socialist Movement chapter in the Northwest paraded a dozen or so sieg-heiling brown shirts around the state Capitol steps in Olympia. It was supposedly a recruiting session for the coming “race war,” the group said.

But instead of shouting or, worse, attacking, protesters dressed up as Nazi clowns to mimic the rally. Ever seen a Nazi clown goose-stepping? It was like “Springtime for Hitler!” Neiwert says after a time onlookers seemed to forget about the deflated white nationalists entirely: “That was the most striking defeat I’ve ever seen dealt to neo-Nazis.”

[Admiral X]

^That's the way to do it.

[Rasp]

Wielding shame also tends to be counter-productive. Compare someone to a nazi? many would rather embrace it. Ignore them and Stop giving these morons a platform. Most of them aren't a real threat and let law enforcement deal with those that are.

This? this is just feels like identity politics run amok - neither side is actually arguing over anything they're just arguing at each other.
What are they even fighting over? best I can tell some cheaply made statues racists put up during the civil rights era to annoy the other side. They were made to be inflammatory and provoke this exact fight.