New York just fucking cancels its Primary

[Captain Crimson]

Because 95% of the people I've had this conversation with over the last 2 months have been people that backed Sanders to the hilt and the over lap between self proclaimed leftists and people complain about SJWs is much higher than you would think as there is a significant minority of Sanders supporters who like him because he shifts the conversation from social issues to economic issues.

A fair enough point, given what I have heard about the Berniebro phenomenon back in 2016 and in 2020, but honestly I was never a fan of Mr. Sanders any more than Mr. Biden.

[Draco Dracul]

Because 95% of the people I've had this conversation with over the last 2 months have been people that backed Sanders to the hilt and the over lap between self proclaimed leftists and people complain about SJWs is much higher than you would think as there is a significant minority of Sanders supporters who like him because he shifts the conversation from social issues to economic issues.

Bernie had become a household name, but his whole platform is based on this reform game so he's essentially competing with anybody advocating Democratic change. In that sense he was practically an established candidate opposite Biden, but he had a whole bunch of people competing for the game he started in 2016 advocating for change.

Outside of Warren and possibly Yang, the candidates in the primary where largely trying to push into Biden's lane as those pushing for more gradual change and as people with broad appeal to the existing democratic base.

Good luck on that I guess. But I get your point. I feel like I saw the most attention go to Sanders, Warren, and a few others, though my nose wasn't in it fully for a lot of names I admit.

Biden to the modern progressive side is like a zombie digging himself out from the Obama admin, and at the same time he got like 5/3 times as many votes.

edit: Oh yeah and the primary wasn't done yet that's true. Sanders quit partially because of the outbreak too.

I mean the primary was done in every practical sense as Sanders had no realistic way to win. Like I think he would have needed something like 2/3s of the remaining delegates to go to a contested convention.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

I mean the primary was done in every practical sense as Sanders had no realistic way to win. Like I think he would have needed something like 2/3s of the remaining delegates to go to a contested convention.

Alright well, Bernie did get a significant amount of votes, and actually kind of swamped the progressive front for that matter to.

Biden's prevalence though is pretty telling of where the Democratic vote is at this day.

Or is it just a matter of people seeing a continuation of the Obama admin?

[Captain Crimson]

I mean the primary was done in every practical sense as Sanders had no realistic way to win. Like I think he would have needed something like 2/3s of the remaining delegates to go to a contested convention.

Alright well, Bernie did get a significant amount of votes, and actually kind of swamped the progressive front for that matter to.

Biden's prevalence though is pretty telling of where the Democratic vote is at this day.

Or is it just a matter of people seeing a continuation of the Obama admin?

As I see it, a continuation of the Obama administration was what Ms. Clinton ran on, and she still lost. To try and continue building on those policies after years of Mr. 45 seem like a misguided approach, at best. Change is either instantaneous or incremental and even if you want to say that Mr. 45 did not set us back that much, he still set the events in motion that will carry over to the next president, whoever that is. This is why I don't like politics. Change is too slow while people keep ignoring history so that it repeats.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

I mean the primary was done in every practical sense as Sanders had no realistic way to win. Like I think he would have needed something like 2/3s of the remaining delegates to go to a contested convention.

Alright well, Bernie did get a significant amount of votes, and actually kind of swamped the progressive front for that matter to.

Biden's prevalence though is pretty telling of where the Democratic vote is at this day.

Or is it just a matter of people seeing a continuation of the Obama admin?

As I see it, a continuation of the Obama administration was what Ms. Clinton ran on, and she still lost. To try and continue building on those policies after years of Mr. 45 seem like a misguided approach, at best. Change is either instantaneous or incremental and even if you want to say that Mr. 45 did not set us back that much, he still set the events in motion that will carry over to the next president, whoever that is. This is why I don't like politics. Change is too slow while people keep ignoring history so that it repeats.

Being a continuation of the Obama administration is pretty vague by means of determining what influenced the outcome of the election. That being said, the Democratic primary has once again continued with the establishment candidate, though it's not such a landslide this time.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

I'll be honest, I don't see the big deal because both parties have already determined their candidate, and Sanders has basically lost all leverage he could have had simply by virtue of losing much harder this time around than he did in 2016.

It strikes me as hypocrisy. I hear Wisconsin kept its GOP primaries open, yes? I'll admit I don't follow cable news, nor would I ever want to, and yet it is the DNC that canceled its primaries, not the GOP, as far as I could tell. That is going to help them tremendously in their campaigns. "We love democracy! We kept our primaries open! If democrats love democracy, why didn't they do that?" Whatever valid reasons you could bring up for this, the COVID-19 spreading around, doesn't matter because it's not about pragmatism, it's about optics.

Bad enough I have to choke down a vote for Mr. Biden this year because I worry about my mom's health. But I just wish the democrats would at least pretend they like the democratic process, even a little bit.

Bluntly, you are recalling that incorrectly. For starters the GOP canceled a large number of primaries before Covid 19 was even known to exist as to prevent even a minor insurgency against Trump. Additionally in Wisconsin the GOP kept the primary open in a bid to tilt a supreme court election in the state, they provided strong mail ballot access to Republican areas while closing almost all polling places in democratic areas hoping to use the long lines and health risks to intimidate Democrats into not turning out.

I stand corrected! Thank you for that revelation.

Even so, I still feel like I could gag. It's like I've sold out. I never intended to vote this year, I never have, I never want to, and yet I feel as if I don't my mother's health will deteriorate even further. She watches MSNBC and... really, that says it all. But I feel like it's a wasted effort since if I vote for Mr. Biden and he loses, it has the same effect, only I've compromised my integrity on a meaningless gesture that goes nowhere. But I have to try.

2020 sure has been rough on all of us.

I'll be honest this kind of sums up why I dislike a lot of self described leftists despite sharing most of their political views. That you could see voting against a fascist like Trump as compromising your integrity speaks to a profound lack of prospective. A big reason why I was never able to back Sanders despite liking much of his policy is that he struck me as someone that would rather maintain his purity than achieve his goals.

Except that's not what he did! He suspended his campaign, even swallowed the big greasy load and endorsed Biden. It's never good enough though, and if anything bad happens, the moderates will STILL blame him and his supporters for the failure instead of looking at their own choices.

[Draco Dracul]

I'll be honest, I don't see the big deal because both parties have already determined their candidate, and Sanders has basically lost all leverage he could have had simply by virtue of losing much harder this time around than he did in 2016.

It strikes me as hypocrisy. I hear Wisconsin kept its GOP primaries open, yes? I'll admit I don't follow cable news, nor would I ever want to, and yet it is the DNC that canceled its primaries, not the GOP, as far as I could tell. That is going to help them tremendously in their campaigns. "We love democracy! We kept our primaries open! If democrats love democracy, why didn't they do that?" Whatever valid reasons you could bring up for this, the COVID-19 spreading around, doesn't matter because it's not about pragmatism, it's about optics.

Bad enough I have to choke down a vote for Mr. Biden this year because I worry about my mom's health. But I just wish the democrats would at least pretend they like the democratic process, even a little bit.

Bluntly, you are recalling that incorrectly. For starters the GOP canceled a large number of primaries before Covid 19 was even known to exist as to prevent even a minor insurgency against Trump. Additionally in Wisconsin the GOP kept the primary open in a bid to tilt a supreme court election in the state, they provided strong mail ballot access to Republican areas while closing almost all polling places in democratic areas hoping to use the long lines and health risks to intimidate Democrats into not turning out.

I stand corrected! Thank you for that revelation.

Even so, I still feel like I could gag. It's like I've sold out. I never intended to vote this year, I never have, I never want to, and yet I feel as if I don't my mother's health will deteriorate even further. She watches MSNBC and... really, that says it all. But I feel like it's a wasted effort since if I vote for Mr. Biden and he loses, it has the same effect, only I've compromised my integrity on a meaningless gesture that goes nowhere. But I have to try.

2020 sure has been rough on all of us.

I'll be honest this kind of sums up why I dislike a lot of self described leftists despite sharing most of their political views. That you could see voting against a fascist like Trump as compromising your integrity speaks to a profound lack of prospective. A big reason why I was never able to back Sanders despite liking much of his policy is that he struck me as someone that would rather maintain his purity than achieve his goals.

Except that's not what he did! He suspended his campaign, even swallowed the big greasy load and endorsed Biden. It's never good enough though, and if anything bad happens, the moderates will STILL blame him and his supporters for the failure instead of looking at their own choices.

Have you not looked at his political career? Because running as an independent for 30 years is very much an act of political grandstanding that works against trying to move the Democratic party leftward. Doing the bare minimum after losing even worse than he did in 2016 isn't going to change that. And I'm no moderate, I was pulling for Sanders over Biden as soon as it was obvious that Warren was no longer viable despite my personal dislike of the man.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

I will say that the provisional rationalizing for what comes down to either voting Democrat, Republican, or other is somewhat dumbfounding. At several junctures between 2016 and now there has just been mounds of people coming to grips with voting for someone they don't want to in order to beat Trump, Biden, etc.

[Draco Dracul]

I will say that the provisional rationalizing for what comes down to either voting Democrat, Republican, or other is somewhat dumbfounding. At several junctures between 2016 and now there has just been mounds of people coming to grips with voting for someone they don't want to in order to beat Trump, Biden, etc.

The nature of FPTP means that a vote for Other is just a vote for the party you like the least.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

I will say that the provisional rationalizing for what comes down to either voting Democrat, Republican, or other is somewhat dumbfounding. At several junctures between 2016 and now there has just been mounds of people coming to grips with voting for someone they don't want to in order to beat Trump, Biden, etc.

The nature of FPTP means that a vote for Other is just a vote for the party you like the least.

More realistically it's just no vote at all. I get the zero sum eventuality of winning the presidency, but if I consider it that way then I'm compelled to say that "Trump got all the votes that weren't for Clinton," meaning anybody that didn't vote because they don't vote and anybody under age and/or out of the country not eligible to vote. Personal politics aside, you can say the same thing in favor of Clinton for all it really matters.

First past the post only means that your vote matters within your state (or county if it comes down to that), instead of directly within the country.