Undocumented immigrants pay more taxes than president 45

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Conservatives about immigration: It's illegal because it's bad and it's bad because it's illegal. Dont' question the law. People with speeding tickets deserve to be shot on sight.

[Riedquat]

Speaking as someone living a country that could very much do without population increases and where immigration is the main driver of population growth I find it hard to be sympathetic with people who keep pushing for immigration. Maybe it's different in the USA; there's certainly a lot more space there. When you're against immigration it quickly becomes clear just how bigoted so many people are though. They fail to grasp the difference between anti-immigration and anti-immigrant, and demonstrate a shocking stupid substitute for thinking based around trying to hammer things into their prejudices. In this case the process goes "Anyone anti-immigration must be a racist therefore you're a racist no matter what reasons you've got, the only possibilities are I'm right or you're a liar."

[Darth Wedgius]

Conservatives about immigration: It's illegal because it's bad and it's bad because it's illegal. Dont' question the law. People with speeding tickets deserve to be shot on sight.

Given up on facts entirely? AOC would approve.

[Darth Wedgius]

Let's examine the claim that immigration restriction must be motivated by racism.

How many countries in the world have fully open borders? This is an easy one. It's a nice, round number. It's the roundest number. Zero.

Are countries in the middle of Africa, surrounded by other African countries, motivated by an unreasoning prejudice regarding Africans? I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest the answer is probably "no".

It appears that immigration restrictions exist that are not motivated by racism.

Some will be happy to assume that there are rational reasons for immigration restriction, but that anyone they don't like are instead motivated by prejudice. Unless they have evidence for that, it can be dismissed.

Logic, folks. Turns out, you don't need pointy ears to use it.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Speaking as someone living a country that could very much do without population increases and where immigration is the main driver of population growth I find it hard to be sympathetic with people who keep pushing for immigration. Maybe it's different in the USA; there's certainly a lot more space there. When you're against immigration it quickly becomes clear just how bigoted so many people are though. They fail to grasp the difference between anti-immigration and anti-immigrant, and demonstrate a shocking stupid substitute for thinking based around trying to hammer things into their prejudices. In this case the process goes "Anyone anti-immigration must be a racist therefore you're a racist no matter what reasons you've got, the only possibilities are I'm right or you're a liar."

Past conventions on immigration into the United States has been a pretty consistent divide between conservatives and liberals, particularly at either tightening or loosening concurrent regulations. America itself in at the very least in modern times is the heaviest country in existence. It's unparalleled. But the political "tension" is localized on the throttle pretty much.

It's only more recently that we have extreme ends of that issue. And while your stance on immigration is more suitably a situation in which you need a parking brake, the situation more reflects the need for a general foot brake while the Executive federal branch is yanking on the emergency brake, and at the same time a bunch of people take your position to be that of the exec. administration's stance.

[Riedquat]

Note I'm in the UK and speaking from a UK perspective, hence why I said it might be different in the USA. In any case though it's fair to say in general sudden changes generally aren't the best way of going about things, although at least they're visible (slow changes can produce significant shifts - for good and bad - without people really noticing).

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Note I'm in the UK and speaking from a UK perspective, hence why I said it might be different in the USA. In any case though it's fair to say in general sudden changes generally aren't the best way of going about things, although at least they're visible (slow changes can produce significant shifts - for good and bad - without people really noticing).

Yeah I know, I covered a lot of bases there. I understand what you were getting at, though the jury is way out on overall effects and impacts on immigration, but general science points to it raising welfare long term given that people are coming here often to work.

[JoeThree]

Note I'm in the UK and speaking from a UK perspective, hence why I said it might be different in the USA. In any case though it's fair to say in general sudden changes generally aren't the best way of going about things, although at least they're visible (slow changes can produce significant shifts - for good and bad - without people really noticing).

It's not, your Muslim "Grooming" Gangs are our MS-13. Illegal immigration/unchecked borders lead to crime, there's no other way around it.

[JoeThree]

Conservatives about immigration: It's illegal because it's bad and it's bad because it's illegal. Dont' question the law. People with speeding tickets deserve to be shot on sight.

Liberals about immigration: It's illegal because they're brown and it's bad because we're white. Don't question it or you're a racist. I learned all this freshman year at college, and anyone who questions the data from the books my professors wrote, sold, and had me work out of is an uneducated bigot.