DIS - Project Deadalus

[CrypticMirror]

Let's bring this back to the actual episode instead of yet another "why I hate Discovery/modern Trek/etc." hatefest.

I feel like it's gonna be a long time before anyone wants to really talk about anything beyond their own gripes about the show in general.

Da sin mer dabei, dat is prihima.

In plain english: "I'm all for ignoring this whole 'I hate Discovery / modern trek" bullshit."
Because, if I'm honest: I don't hate any Trek / Wars / Who / Gate related - well, except Universe, that dark and gritty bad fanfic of Stargate.

Well we are not gonna not talk about the dark and gritty bad fanfic of Trek, Discovery either. How you feel about Universe is how we feel about DSC.

So for me the only improvement DISCO can make at this point is to dial down on Burnham being the center of things and give more stuff for other characters. S2 was a small step towards that, giving bridge officers more of a personality, which they didn't seem to have during the first season. And if the announcement of STRANGE NEW WORLDS is any indication, the producers DO listen to the fans as giving Pike his own show was one of the big demands. Hopefully they've heard enough of the criticisms of Michael being too centered and will account for that with the third season.

Move into the Twenty Fifth Century, ignore the spores, Section Thirty One, give us a bright new hopeful Starship Discovery populated by all new characters, and the new ship shows that the progression of Discovery vessels does not include a pizza cutter design, retcon it all into a bad dream.

If Strange New Worlds does happen, and the way things are going that is far from a sure thing, it'll feel more like scraps from the end of the table and will in no way make those who did not get on the Discovery bandwagon feel happier in any way. The only way a Pike series will improve things is if they commit to making DSC occur in its own special alternate dimension so that The Chair and living in the Lotus Eater prison is not Pike's eventual fate.

A Pike centric series that does not tackle that canonical end point is doomed to failure by default. It has an inevitable downer ending. If they want to hear fans, then they need to just walk away from Discovery while whistling nonchalantly, because it is unsalvageable now due to the amount of doubling down they did on the bad ideas of the first two seasons. Especially the damn Saru thing, when the smart thing would to have been to hustle him off the ship post haste and never mention him again instead of... that. And don't even get me started on the idiocy of those short films, especially the Andromeda-verse tie-in one they did.

[CaptainCalvinCat]

Let's bring this back to the actual episode instead of yet another "why I hate Discovery/modern Trek/etc." hatefest.

I feel like it's gonna be a long time before anyone wants to really talk about anything beyond their own gripes about the show in general.

Da sin mer dabei, dat is prihima.

In plain english: "I'm all for ignoring this whole 'I hate Discovery / modern trek" bullshit."
Because, if I'm honest: I don't hate any Trek / Wars / Who / Gate related - well, except Universe, that dark and gritty bad fanfic of Stargate.

Well we are not gonna not talk about the dark and gritty bad fanfic of Trek, Discovery either. How you feel about Universe is how we feel about DSC.

I can see that, however I think that DSC is wayy more watchable than SGU. It is not that dark, that grim, that offensive as SGU was. Plus: Season 2 was much better.

[chaos42]

the problem is when writers loose focus and star obsessing over one character and bending the laws of the world to make them right or the hero all the time. thats when its mary sue territory because having a character who is good at a lot of things or over powered is typical in fiction. The problem was michael was always the focus and always right. its like rey everything bends to make her right. we need better writers and better set up.

and i think discovery could be good with whats been happening, everything is dependent on what happens after all this crap happens

[Link8909]

Let's bring this back to the actual episode instead of yet another "why I hate Discovery/modern Trek/etc." hatefest.

I feel like it's gonna be a long time before anyone wants to really talk about anything beyond their own gripes about the show in general.

Da sin mer dabei, dat is prihima.

In plain english: "I'm all for ignoring this whole 'I hate Discovery / modern trek" bullshit."
Because, if I'm honest: I don't hate any Trek / Wars / Who / Gate related - well, except Universe, that dark and gritty bad fanfic of Stargate.

I’m on board for that mind set, I personally am really liking this new era of trek so far, I thought Season 1 and 2 of Discovery was pretty good, and season 1 of Picard was fantastic, I'm looking forward to Season 3 of Discovery and Lower Decks, and to add to the controversy I really enjoyed all of the Sequel movies of Star Wars.

But as much as I like these shows and Movies, I think it’s also important acknowledge the flaws in them, ignoring them will not allow the creative teams behind those works to improve them, it is also as important to be as calm and constructive as possible when talking about these flaws, you can be right, but wrong at the top of your voice.

[Thebestoftherest]

I also feel we need to accept that not all star trek is during Kirk era please of please go forward and stay forward

[Link8909]

Well we are not gonna not talk about the dark and gritty bad fanfic of Trek, Discovery either. How you feel about Universe is how we feel about DSC.

I can see that, however I think that DSC is wayy more watchable than SGU. It is not that dark, that grim, that offensive as SGU was. Plus: Season 2 was much better.

I personally think new Star Trek writers should not be afraid to tell dark stories, and in fact every show in the franchise (even The Animated Series) has done so, and a lot of them are considered classic episodes, I think the issue comes down to the consistency of a dark tone in these new series, partially with Season 1 of Discovery, past Star Trek shows were episodic and could tell different styles of stories each week, Discovery and Picard are serialized stories and keeps a consistent tone throughout, the only past Star Trek series to have a consistent tone to it was Season 3 of Enterprise, and it was a very dark tone as well (Deep Space Nine was able to shift tones each episode even during the Dominion War), and giving the fact as well that this is the first show in over a decade and people were expecting a more "traditional" Star Trek series, the best example I can give is if instead of The Next Generation back in 1987 it was instead Deep Space Nine starting with Call To Arms (at the end of season 5) with little context for prier events.

I also personally think Star Trek Picard was better at going dark than Season 1 of Discovery, not only did it make sense (for me at least) the Federation and the Romulans were the way they were because of how the TNG era was left due to the events in Deep Space Nine and Star Trek (2009), but you also had Picard himself to consistently be the moral compass of the series to counter the darker elements, always being kind, always willing to do the right thing no matter what, and always trying to inspire others to be a better person, and by the end of Season 1 had indeed inspired the people he travelled with to be better.

Also, while I haven’t seen Stargate Universe, I can name a few shows that are a lot darker than both Season 1's of Discovery and Picard.

Marco Polo, Homeland, Spartacus, Frontier, Vikings, The Last Kingdom, Poldark, Thieves of the Wood and Man in the High Castle are all shows much darker than both Discovery and Picard combined.

[Makeshift Python]

I really don't get the complaints about Trek being stuck in the 23rd century, when we have PICARD set in the 25th and DISCO is going to be set in the 30th. We essentially have multiple Trek shows each set in a different era of Trek. I actually think that's cooler than how it was in the 90s when we had different Trek shows/films but they were all concurrently set in the very same year in the 24th century, with the exception of TUC.

[Thebestoftherest]

Becuase any trek fan know that nothing important would happen in the past becuase if it was it would be mention.

[Link8909]

I really don't get the complaints about Trek being stuck in the 23rd century, when we have PICARD set in the 25th and DISCO is going to be set in the 30th. We essentially have multiple Trek shows each set in a different era of Trek. I actually think that's cooler than how it was in the 90s when we had different Trek shows/films but they were all concurrently set in the very same year in the 24th century, with the exception of TUC.

Becuase any trek fan know that nothing important would happen in the past becuase if it was it would be mention.

I personally don't think that's entirely true, there are huge gaps in Star Treks history that we know little to nothing about that could make for an interesting story either as a Short Trek or as a full series, I'm looking forward to Strange New Worlds because of this, and while we do know Captain Pike fate, it will be interesting to see what missions he and his crew had, and just as important to see how he lived, so that he isn't just "That guy in the iron-lung who beeps."

On this subject as well, with multiple different Star Trek shows in the works, I wouldn't appose a revival of Star Trek Enterprise in some shape or form, maybe an animated show styled like The Clone Wars, telling the story on the Romulan War, how the Federation was formed, and even some early exploration.

[chaos42]

does anyone know why i keep seeing so many people bashing picard?

it had a strong start and some decent work, got a little weak at the end and it was a little clunky but it was ok.