Coronavirus - the new pandemic

[Antiboyscout]

So first off, we have the wikipedia defined demographic concentration of African Americans coming to 12% of the total population, compared to whites being at 73%.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States#Race_and_ethnicity

Then the first statistic I found on Google had 2020 fatal police shootings at 88 for black and 172 for whites, so about 1/2 as much despite having 1/6 times the population.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/

Oh boy statistics. Here's one for ya 13/50

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

So first off, we have the wikipedia defined demographic concentration of African Americans coming to 12% of the total population, compared to whites being at 73%.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States#Race_and_ethnicity

Then the first statistic I found on Google had 2020 fatal police shootings at 88 for black and 172 for whites, so about 1/2 as much despite having 1/6 times the population.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/

Oh boy statistics. Here's one for ya 13/50

I'm guessing there's a bit to unpack there.

[Darth Wedgius]

I have a feeling that you and I are on too different a spectrum to ever agree on this.
I don't know what evidence you would want, and I find your characterization of events unfolding to be inaccurate at best and tinged with bad faith.
However I will try to respond to things as best I can, and leave you with this overarching criticism, please proof read, I am not holding it against you in this instance, but frequent misspellings are unforced errors that give your opponent ammunition.

Which pictures did you select from the protests? I can select others.

https://media.graytvinc.com/images/stevens+point+blm+protest+6+7.jpg

And https://cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/150427233401-16-baltimore-clashes-0427-exlarge-169.jpg

Why did you link to the images specifically and not the articles associated with them?
Also, I linked galleries, link more stuff, so as to illustrate a meaningful pattern of behavior, rather than two images that could be dismissed as outliers.

And here, as protesters beat a man, you can clearly see them not applying proper social distancing, and some are missing masks. That can't be good, right?

youtu.be/0gwb1VqqVLQ

Point taken, people should be wearing masks.... BUT, I am a little confused as to why you pivoted to the whole "beating a man" angle which is why I see your characterization of events as tinged with bad faith, as you are trying to shift the discussion toward bad characterization of the protesters rather than the Covid discussions.
Also:
Sky News? Where have I heard of that before? Oh, that is right, they were founded by Rupert Murdoch, owner of Fox News. Do you consider them a trustworthy source?
You don't find it a little suspicious that a clip which starts with complaining about "The Left" and then shows clips of violence without commentary beyond, "This doesn't look peaceful" might be a little suspect? And not just them re appropriating words like "Gas Lighting" to make it seem like protesters (of which there are many orders of magnitude more than the police) are out of control?
The police are a funded and regimented group, videos of their misconduct are to be held to a higher standard than the protesters. If you hear a news organization trying to characterize the protesters by their worst members, do keep in mind that they should be holding the police to a much higher standard.

As to different causes having different work, don't cherry pick. Besides the "I want a haircut" you also have people saying, "I want my job back." Or simply people who want liberty back, which I think a noble cause in and of itself.

No.
While "I want my job back" is an interesting position, considering it is not the government taking away jobs it is companies that furloughed or fired workers because of the shutdowns. If the protesters had wanted unemployment insurance to get them thru the disaster (and it is a disaster) I am all for that, but again, arguing for some abstract form of "liberty" during a pandemic is nonsense.
We live in a civilization that is in the midst of a plague, people need to stay home.

As to the legitimacy of the protests, not wanting to be murdered by cops is a good one. However, such murder is pretty infrequent in the U.S. compared to other causes of death for black people in the U.S. Will exposing themselves to SARS-COV-2 really help?

Look at it this way: black kill whites in America far more frequently than whites kill blacks. If I started up a march saying, "Stop killing our people!", regardless of whether you agreed with it, would you agree with dismissing any SARS-COV-2 concerns? It's not the same situation, I'll grant you. Murder under color of authority seems especially heinous to me. But certainly not wanting to be murdered is a good and noble cause, right?

First off, the blight of minorities in the United States is an interrelated one. You can't say, "Sure all the police murder is bad, but compared to the diabetes and obesity it isn't bad" and think that is a rational argument. Police violence and the myriad other systemic failures of the government in regard to minorities are all fruit of the same poison tree. Comparing murder rates with the "black kill whites" bullshit you listed is unsourced and also bullshit.

I don't expect you (and I am not going to) write some kind of peer reviewed paper on racial violence in America. And you probably do not have access to the online resources I do (I work at a university and can still search for articles) and I don't want to work for free changing your mind.

All I am saying is that there is a moral and functional difference between the current protests that are for racial justice in America, and those protests about people wanting to go back to sports bars during a pandemic. Doctors have rightly acknowledged the moral difference between these things, and I agree with them, only regretting that Covid will gain legs during this time... Not even because of the protesters, just because Americans are stupid and with all of the protests crowding up the news and head space, Covid is going to slip people's minds and they will go back to acting like nothing is wrong.

Being founded by Rupert Murdoch is not a reason, AFAIK, to consider video they present as unreliable. Do you think they hired actors? Is there a framing that would make that scene look better?

People being unemployed or furloughed is not just something a company does without reason. If a company cannot afford to pay its employees, it cannot afford to pay them. And
the governments are not magic money-making machines, at least not in the long term. Countries have tried to create or sustain wealth through control of money, and you end up with empty shelves(the old socialist joke, "we pretend to work, and they pretend to pay us"), and sometimes with practically worthless money and the country eventually pinning its currency to the dollar. Which won't work for the dollar. Then there are the self-employed.

If you want a source on the more black killed whites than whites killed blacks, https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2016-09-29/race-and-homicide-in-america-by-the-numbers is one. Note: more whites kill whites, and more blacks kill blacks. The people that stay together, slay together, I suppose.

Treating illegal homicide by police by the number of people killed is precisely rational. It's the emotional tinges that make it matter more to people.

And, to hopefully make myself clear, I wasn't saying that black people have no right to protest because blacks kill whites more than whites kill blacks. I was asking if, in your opinion, it would be OK for whites to protest similarly as far as Covid 19 risks go. It is, after all, protesting against murder.

Now, what you feel are "systemic failures" and what I would consider "system failures" are probably irreconcilable. I see single mothers, lack of educational achievement, and the only official discrimination I am aware of discriminates in favor of minorities. Also, black immigrants earn more than US-born blacks. You may feel, as many on the left do, that if a group of people are lacking something, then it is the government's responsibility to step in and provide that need. I don't. I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just not my opinion.

If you feel that past wrongs against blacks, from slavery to Jim Crow, and/or the current educational, criminal, and.or economic state of black Americans gives BLM protesters a special privilege to make protests despite Covid 19, that's fine. I don't, but I don't think there is an objective answer, so, again, I can't say you're wrong.

I was originally pointing out the political influence over the decision. I think that gives people reason to weigh such proclamations as not coming purely from medical science. Would that be fair?

Also, thank you for calling me out on typos. I've tried to be more careful in this response, but I'm sure there something wiggled its way in here or they're.

[Antiboyscout]

So first off, we have the wikipedia defined demographic concentration of African Americans coming to 12% of the total population, compared to whites being at 73%.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States#Race_and_ethnicity

Then the first statistic I found on Google had 2020 fatal police shootings at 88 for black and 172 for whites, so about 1/2 as much despite having 1/6 times the population.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/

Oh boy statistics. Here's one for ya 13/50

I'm guessing there's a bit to unpack there.

Blacks commit around 50% of all homicides

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

So first off, we have the wikipedia defined demographic concentration of African Americans coming to 12% of the total population, compared to whites being at 73%.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States#Race_and_ethnicity

Then the first statistic I found on Google had 2020 fatal police shootings at 88 for black and 172 for whites, so about 1/2 as much despite having 1/6 times the population.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/

Oh boy statistics. Here's one for ya 13/50

I'm guessing there's a bit to unpack there.

Blacks commit around 50% of all homicides

And perhaps should be punished accordingly, and not in a manner of taking away everyone's race card. That statistic if true doesn't change the politics of Black Lives Matter.

And these aren't just all points on a scoreboard. One side involves government security highly accountable to the public for the matter, while one is just basic people in the eyes of the law.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

As all of this goes on, remember the incubation period. It's easy to make mental leaps about cause and effect, but a big gathering of people is not causally related to an uptick in the virus just a few days later. Look for gatherings about two weeks back to explain virus upticks.

Still annoyed with my governor for reopening philly so early. Yeah, sure, it's "yellow" rather than "green" but few people know what those traffic light things actually mean in practical terms and even fewer will stick to the rules.

I've learned enough about people's lack of restraint in the 8 minutes I spent waiting for a cab to pick me up from physical therapy to know that even during red zone time a lot of people won't bother with a mask or will hang it under their chin like a gods-damned cartoon character with a toothache.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Well dang, there sure are a lot of mysterious pneumonia cases. Pretty sure this has nothing to do with states re-opening as soon as they got tired of it.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Ithica is straight up canceling rent for the duration of the pandemic
https://www.fastcompany.com/90515205/ithaca-new-york-is-the-first-u-s-city-to-say-it-will-cancel-rent-during-the-pandemic

Good for them.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

This could be us, but you playin https://www.sfgate.com/science/article/Study-100-face-mask-use-could-crush-second-15333170.php?utm_campaign=CMS+Sharing+Tools+%28Desktop%29&utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Looks like we don't really have a second wave coming...because we're still in the first one.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/06/12/876224115/coronavirus-second-wave-nope-were-still-stuck-in-the-first-one?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=npr&utm_medium=social&utm_term=nprnews

ffs