Another day, another police beating in America

[Captain Crimson]

Poor GreyICE. His brain is broken. I can hear the grinding of the hamster wheel from here.

Some cops are good people. Some cops are bad people.

If I gave a list of nasty things done by black people, nobody in their (IMHO) right mind would think that justifies "Blacks aren't good people." GreyICE is the type to think in such directions, he's just pointed at different targets.

Poor GreyICE.

You realize that ACAB is fundamentally a statement about systemic corruption and that even cops who do not partake in acts of corruption or brutality themselves are complicit in the actions of those who do because either through indifference or fear of reprisal. As a rule good cops don't last because the are either drummed out of the service or murdered.

That's more nuanced than GreyICE's "here's bad things cops did so all cops are bad" drivel, but we've seen good cops. I mean, good cops don't last forever, because people don't, I've seen nothing clearly showing that all, or even most, of the cops that retire are corrupt or brutal, as you are suggesting.

I'm saying that one cannot be a good cop while turning a blind eye to bad cops. If one is a police officer and not actively fighting the systemic corruption within the department they are fundamentally complicit in it. Were good cops even remotely common we wouldn't have the protests we have now because George Floyd's murderers would have been arrested the same day.

You would hold that same standard to army soldiers who hear rumors, but are far removed the source of war crimes to do anything about that, and so there is nothing they can do and reasons they remain silent. You would hold the same view to citizens who uphold and support a police state that is lying to them and twisting their thinking. There's nuance here. You don't see it.

[Draco Dracul]

Poor GreyICE. His brain is broken. I can hear the grinding of the hamster wheel from here.

Some cops are good people. Some cops are bad people.

If I gave a list of nasty things done by black people, nobody in their (IMHO) right mind would think that justifies "Blacks aren't good people." GreyICE is the type to think in such directions, he's just pointed at different targets.

Poor GreyICE.

You realize that ACAB is fundamentally a statement about systemic corruption and that even cops who do not partake in acts of corruption or brutality themselves are complicit in the actions of those who do because either through indifference or fear of reprisal. As a rule good cops don't last because the are either drummed out of the service or murdered.

That's more nuanced than GreyICE's "here's bad things cops did so all cops are bad" drivel, but we've seen good cops. I mean, good cops don't last forever, because people don't, I've seen nothing clearly showing that all, or even most, of the cops that retire are corrupt or brutal, as you are suggesting.

I'm saying that one cannot be a good cop while turning a blind eye to bad cops. If one is a police officer and not actively fighting the systemic corruption within the department they are fundamentally complicit in it. Were good cops even remotely common we wouldn't have the protests we have now because George Floyd's murderers would have been arrested the same day.

You would hold that same standard to army soldiers who hear rumors, but are far removed the source of war crimes to do anything about that, and so there is nothing they can do and reasons they remain silent. You would hold the same view to citizens who uphold and support a police state that is lying to them and twisting their thinking. There's nuance here. You don't see it.

It's actually quite funny, I would think that the soldier would be both far less complicit because the size and distribution of the army allows for far more degrees of separation that police departments do (as a soldier could be stationed out of Germany and hear of warcrimes in the middle east), but also more cowardly because the Military does a lot more to protect whistle blowers and punish malfeasance than the police do.

A cop has significantly more individual power in the department than a random citizen of a totalitarian dictatorship.

Ironically by preaching these very different scenarios as the same, you yourself are showing a profound lack of nuance.

[Darth Wedgius]

Poor GreyICE. His brain is broken. I can hear the grinding of the hamster wheel from here.

Some cops are good people. Some cops are bad people.

If I gave a list of nasty things done by black people, nobody in their (IMHO) right mind would think that justifies "Blacks aren't good people." GreyICE is the type to think in such directions, he's just pointed at different targets.

Poor GreyICE.

You realize that ACAB is fundamentally a statement about systemic corruption and that even cops who do not partake in acts of corruption or brutality themselves are complicit in the actions of those who do because either through indifference or fear of reprisal. As a rule good cops don't last because the are either drummed out of the service or murdered.

That's more nuanced than GreyICE's "here's bad things cops did so all cops are bad" drivel, but we've seen good cops. I mean, good cops don't last forever, because people don't, I've seen nothing clearly showing that all, or even most, of the cops that retire are corrupt or brutal, as you are suggesting.

I'm saying that one cannot be a good cop while turning a blind eye to bad cops. If one is a police officer and not actively fighting the systemic corruption within the department they are fundamentally complicit in it. Were good cops even remotely common we wouldn't have the protests we have now because George Floyd's murderers would have been arrested the same day.

What if one doesn't see corruption or brutality first-hand? There's usually a specialized department for that.

If one is a teacher and not fighting incompetent teachers, is one a bad teacher?

[Draco Dracul]

Poor GreyICE. His brain is broken. I can hear the grinding of the hamster wheel from here.

Some cops are good people. Some cops are bad people.

If I gave a list of nasty things done by black people, nobody in their (IMHO) right mind would think that justifies "Blacks aren't good people." GreyICE is the type to think in such directions, he's just pointed at different targets.

Poor GreyICE.

You realize that ACAB is fundamentally a statement about systemic corruption and that even cops who do not partake in acts of corruption or brutality themselves are complicit in the actions of those who do because either through indifference or fear of reprisal. As a rule good cops don't last because the are either drummed out of the service or murdered.

That's more nuanced than GreyICE's "here's bad things cops did so all cops are bad" drivel, but we've seen good cops. I mean, good cops don't last forever, because people don't, I've seen nothing clearly showing that all, or even most, of the cops that retire are corrupt or brutal, as you are suggesting.

I'm saying that one cannot be a good cop while turning a blind eye to bad cops. If one is a police officer and not actively fighting the systemic corruption within the department they are fundamentally complicit in it. Were good cops even remotely common we wouldn't have the protests we have now because George Floyd's murderers would have been arrested the same day.

What if one doesn't see corruption or brutality first-hand? There's usually a specialized department for that.

If one is a teacher and not fighting incompetent teachers, is one a bad teacher?

Well for one we have seen over the last few weeks that most cops respond to seeing brutality first hand by either passively letting or actively joining in. I actually think the old man assaulted in Buffalo really highlights it because we can see a man give up on being a good cop because he's pressured by others.

That's not really comparable as dealing with adult incompetence isn't a teacher's job, dealing with criminals is a cop's job.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

ACAB does sound more like you're talking about all cops in general though.

That ignores the point. If 1 bad cop kills a man by stepping on his neck, and 3 stand by and watch, all four are bad. If 1 bad cop shoots a man in the back, and a police union representing that cop gets him reinstated without dissent, every cop that sat idly by and allowed that to happen rather than demanding better from their union is complicit. If one good cop tries to report corruption and malfeasance and the entire department organizes to punish and exclude that cop until they're driven out of the force, every cop still there is, professionally, a bastard.

And you dig further and further down and realize... this is the nature of policing. It's always been like this and is designed to be like this. All Cops Are Bastards because the entire system is designed to reward bastards and those who let bastards get on with their bastard business, and punish everyone who dares interfere with that system.


That's one beauty of Defunding the Police as a first line of action: if we're shrinking a police force, the first thing we do is relieve them these duties they can't perform, and shuffle resources to groups who have specialized training and, perhaps, can.

I'm fine with collective implications, but it does become a matter of itself when there's that much talk about it.

Of course actually googling it I find that it doesn't mean All Cops are Bad, but All Cops are Bastards which is a more entrenched context for consideration allowing for instance more rooted interpretations pointing towards the institution. But yeah, I and like millions of people, tend to digress into the word "all," which isn't really interchangeable with "the institution." And of course I'm not gonna side with the everybody who thinks that semantics is a legitimate form of political protest, you have to be able to talks about something with a root subject and not just its symptomatic effects or word salad implications. I do see that the poeticism in movements calls for pressed expressions, and that Black Lives Matter Also doesn't have the same imperative ring as Black Lives Matter, but we've had virtually inexhaustible discussion on how BLM isn't OBLM.

We could be sympathetic perhaps. Some of this shit is cops put in a no win scenario. If some semi-homeless person keeps going into McDonalds to harass the employees and they keep calling the police, because that's what they're supposed to do... what the fuck are cops supposed to do exactly? Arrest them? They're just loitering. Haul them off to the hospital? You can't force someone to be examined and go through a drug regimen.

If defunding is an established administrative practice, then I got less questions already. Though I'd imagine a separate city department or division of an existing department would be established that would make it pretty convenient for the PD involvement to dissolve.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

the FBI put out a report that showed active purposeful infiltration of both the military and police by white supremacists. The FBI included a list of steps to take in order to help prevent this including things like updated lists of identifying tattoos and specific screening measures. The military said fuck we thought we were getting them all, thank you, and started implementing all the recommended procedures almost immediately.

The U.S. Police Union wrote the FBI back a letter that basically said “fuck you you can’t tell us who we can and can’t hire” and then the funding for that FBI investigation got suddenly yanked.

Police unions are bastards, police higher ups are bastards, and any policeman who isn't a bastard will be immediately crushed by the ones that are. So, in effect, ACAB.

https://theintercept.com/2017/01/31/the-fbi-has-quietly-investigated-white-supremacist-infiltration-of-law-enforcement/

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Well maybe the FBI should have communicated a little more clearly.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

The FBI investigators "Were no angels" and may have had a history of drug use.
The FBI investigatiors my have had weapons.
The FBI investigation was behaving threateningly, refused to comply and failed to disperse when given a verbal warning.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

The FBI investigators "Were no angels" and may have had a history of drug use.

I smoked a little bit of pot here and there back in my day.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

@aVoice4MA6
·
Jun 16
In the 20 days since #GeorgeFloyd, police have killed 120 more people.
SIX PER DAY.

What bogleech said still stands. The police are not James Bond. The badge shouldn't be a license to kill. You want to execute somebody, no matter what they did, you should go through a process with a trial and jury and lawyers, not just gun them down in the street and say it was because they were scary.