Fuzzy Necromancer wrote:Now THAT would make a lot more sense.
The more I think about it, the more the founders as actual shapechanging agents seem like a vastly underused asset in the war.
We don't actually know how many founders were still in the Alpha Quadrant after the wormhole was made off-limits, it's not like they could bring in any more. :\
While never stated directly, a lot of the Female Changeling's dialogue implies its just her and Odo on this side of the wormhole.
Durandal_1707 wrote:I don't ignore that, I'm including their Dominion collusion in the list of things that make no damn sense other than "Orion Syndicate Bad! AQ War Effort Good!"
Even if you had access to the rest of the Founders, they are god in their own minds and akin to cats IMO, good luck getting them to do things they don't want to do like low-level criminal interactions.
Robovski wrote:Even if you had access to the rest of the Founders, they are god in their own minds and akin to cats IMO, good luck getting them to do things they don't want to do like low-level criminal interactions.
See, that is established...yet they seem very willing, even happy, to go in on suicide missions (see the killer vase and Changeling Bashir). What's up with that?
"Believe me, there’s nothing so terrible that someone won’t support it."
— Un Lun Dun, China Mieville
Robovski wrote:Even if you had access to the rest of the Founders, they are god in their own minds and akin to cats IMO, good luck getting them to do things they don't want to do like low-level criminal interactions.
See, that is established...yet they seem very willing, even happy, to go in on suicide missions (see the killer vase and Changeling Bashir). What's up with that?
Most likely they view a single Changeling giving their lives of their own free will as expendable - after all, all of their memories and experiences are part of the Great Link (I almost messed up and typed Collective ...) so they're effectively immortal. They just lose it over someone ELSE killing one of them because they view it as an assault on the whole species, because of their extreme xenophobia and superiority complex.
Durandal_1707 wrote:
Sure, there's the character of Bilby having sympathetic sides to him despite being a killer, but that's just part of Al Pacino's character in Donnie Brasco that came along for the ride when they ripped that movie off.
I don't see that the originality (or lack thereof) of the Bilby makes any difference to the point of whether or not a morally gray character fits into DS9 better than the other series. And Bilby isn't doing what he does to be evil or because he thinks he and other bad guys should all go to the same club. It's a job. Some people clean sewers, some people assassinate Klingons.
Post-scarcity Federation... Assuming he didn't somehow grow up outside of the Federation and lacks the citizenship and thus access to all those resources, then he has no reason to get such a job outside of him willingly and intentionally killing people.
"If you get shot up by an A6M Reisen and your plane splits into pieces - does that mean it's divided by Zero?
- xoxSAUERKRAUTxox
Madner Kami wrote:Post-scarcity Federation... Assuming he didn't somehow grow up outside of the Federation and lacks the citizenship and thus access to all those resources, then he has no reason to get such a job outside of him willingly and intentionally killing people.
Even in Gene Roddenberry's idealized future, there are still humans who are greedy, unscrupulous little bastards (Harry Mudd, anyone?).
Madner Kami wrote:Post-scarcity Federation... Assuming he didn't somehow grow up outside of the Federation and lacks the citizenship and thus access to all those resources, then he has no reason to get such a job outside of him willingly and intentionally killing people.
Even in Gene Roddenberry's idealized future, there are still humans who are greedy, unscrupulous little bastards (Harry Mudd, anyone?).
That's 60's Roddenberry though. 80's Roddenberry wouldn't approve scripts written by 60's Roddenberry.
Madner Kami wrote:Post-scarcity Federation... Assuming he didn't somehow grow up outside of the Federation and lacks the citizenship and thus access to all those resources, then he has no reason to get such a job outside of him willingly and intentionally killing people.
Even in Gene Roddenberry's idealized future, there are still humans who are greedy, unscrupulous little bastards (Harry Mudd, anyone?).
That's 60's Roddenberry though. 80's Roddenberry wouldn't approve scripts written by 60's Roddenberry.
In the words of Sword Art Online Abridged:
SAO wrote:Kirito: I'm not responsible for Stoned!Kirito's actions. That guy's an idiot!
Asuna: YOU'RE THE SAME PERSON!!1!!
I'm assuming that in the 60s, Roddenberry was power-leveling his Alchemy, and ate some strange plants.
I feel like with all the female-friendly stuff Gene wrote or approved, in both eras, male-monogamy is a lost concept on him, anyway. See: All the drama about Troi moving onto other men and Riker boning every other woman with a well-natured chuckle that slipped by his desk.
