a disturbing thought i had about star trek DS9 and the dominon war (Spoilers)

[aceina]

odds are after the war the cardasians will end up joining the federation durring the rebuilding as they are in shambles

the klingons will likely after a civil war or something end up joining to

the romulans after nemesis are in no shape to do much of anything the federation helps them they join to

my thoughts thoe

section 31 what if they saw this out come of the domion war and some how set things in motion they did end up giving the changelings a virus meaning they knew the federation would win in the end

and the federation can also now get a foot hold in dominion space as the dominion will collapse

[SlackerinDeNile]

Didn't that episode of Voyager 'relativity' kind of hint at this?

[Archanubis]

Star Trek: Online kind of hints this is where the Cardassians are going; the main government is still independent, but dependent on the Federation (and, on a less direct extent, the Klingons and Romulan Republic) for economic and military support, especially in dealing with the True Way. It wouldn't be surprising to see them join up with the Federation.

Others, not so much. The Klingons apparently have gone back to their old ways (basically using fear of Undine (Species 8479) infiltration as an excuse). They've basically conquered the Gorn and turned them into a client state, in addition, they've allied themselves with the Orion Syndicate and have been hiring mercenaries from the Nausicaans, Letheans, and apparently a Kzinti-expy called the Ferasans, if the latter isn't a client state like the Gorn (the situation's not entirely clear to me).

The Romulans have apparently fragmented into three factions. The first is the Romulan Republic, which is the main (playable) power in game; they're apparently the more stable of the three, at least by the end of the Romulan storyline. The second is elements of the old Romulan Star Empire loyal to the Tal Shiar, the old "secret police" of that state, and the third is other RSE elements loyal their self-proclaimed empress, Sela. The latter two started out allied with each other, but events in the game have them eventually turn against each other; apparently by 2410-2411 (unsure of the timeframe at this point), they're both little more than rump states. None of them are really looking to become members of the Federation: the Tal Shiar and Sela are still too pissed about Romulus, and while the Republic does seek aid and recognition from the Federation (and Klingons), their Preator, D'Tan, is more interested in keeping out of both powers' affairs for the time being.

[Beastro]

odds are after the war the cardasians will end up joining the federation durring the rebuilding as they are in shambles

the klingons will likely after a civil war or something end up joining to

the romulans after nemesis are in no shape to do much of anything the federation helps them they join to

my thoughts thoe

section 31 what if they saw this out come of the domion war and some how set things in motion they did end up giving the changelings a virus meaning they knew the federation would win in the end

and the federation can also now get a foot hold in dominion space as the dominion will collapse

I'd rather see the post-war forces setting up a government that would make Cardassia the least likely to start more trouble, namely one modeled after the Fed.

Klingon civil war I'd rather see breaking the empire apart into numerous warring nations, hopefully resulting in a permanent fracturing of the klingon race into several separate nations, something which Star Trek really, really needs to have given it's "One race, one nation" mentality.

It's not simply Nemesis the damaged the Romulans, the Star Trek remake had Spock heading to save their asses and he vanished. That result would be the destruction of Romulus when the Romulands relied on the Federation to help them, and on top of it all, it came down to a Vulcan helping them that wound up screwing things up.

They will not be doing anything close to being friendly with the Federation after that. I could see the Romulan Empire forming the main opposition to Federation hegemony in the Alpha Quadrant after that actively pushing to undermine them in anyway they can.

my thoughts thoe

section 31 what if they saw this out come of the domion war and some how set things in motion they did end up giving the changelings a virus meaning they knew the federation would win in the end

and the federation can also now get a foot hold in dominion space as the dominion will collapse

Waaaaay too much hindsight. Section 31 are a very competent shadow branch of the government, not fortune tellers.

Didn't that episode of Voyager 'relativity' kind of hint at this?

Star Trek has always had a triumphalist mentality when it came to the Federation.

It needs to be taken down a few pegs, and the Dominion War causing a "Vietnam Syndrome" of sorts as the Federation withdraws reluctant to get their hands dirty again as the AQ degenerates with the Klingon Empire disintegrating and the Romulans gunning to unravel their hegemony is a perfect setting for a post-Dominion War series to re-inject a sense of vulnerability back in their situation again.

[SlackerinDeNile]

Didn't that episode of Voyager 'relativity' kind of hint at this?

Star Trek has always had a triumphalist mentality when it came to the Federation.

It needs to be taken down a few pegs, and the Dominion War causing a "Vietnam Syndrome" of sorts as the Federation withdraws reluctant to get their hands dirty again as the AQ degenerates with the Klingon Empire disintegrating and the Romulans gunning to unravel their hegemony is a perfect setting for a post-Dominion War series to re-inject a sense of vulnerability back in their situation again.

I agree, it's a shame we never really got to see a post-DS9 story other than various books, fan-fics and Star Trek Online.
Some of the books and fan-fics are pretty good though.

[ChiggyvonRichthofen]

I don't see the Cardassians actually joining the Federation. Occupying Bajor, extreme tensions with the Federation, joining the Dominion, and eventually turning against the Dominion- all these decisions stem from the same strong jingoistic tendencies. Trying to get them to join the Federation would be courting disaster. I see them as being in the same situation as the Klingons in Star Trek VI. A lot of them don't want help, but common sense will win the day for most. Still, there's going to be an extreme, reactionary nationalism, and if things aren't handled properly another war could be possible down the line.

The Klingons are always dysfunctional, but I think the change in leadership and the close alliance with the Federation during the war will bring relations with the Federation to an all-time high. Depending on each other to avoid ultimate defeat in a Galactic War will have a unifying effect. Still, the volatile Klingon political system will always leave room for eventual conflict.

I don't see the Romulans being affected by the war. As problematic as post-DS9 films have been, they bare out the idea that the Romulans have more defining issues within their own borders. The Federation's relationship with them remains precarious.

The Federation will continue on its more cautious, frankly more realistic, "post 9/11" attitude. Section 31 will fade into the background once again.

[aceina]

the cardasians are very much like post world war 2 japan they are a broken nation

[Archanubis]

I don't see the Cardassians actually joining the Federation. Occupying Bajor, extreme tensions with the Federation, joining the Dominion, and eventually turning against the Dominion- all these decisions stem from the same strong jingoistic tendencies. Trying to get them to join the Federation would be courting disaster. I see them as being in the same situation as the Klingons in Star Trek VI. A lot of them don't want help, but common sense will win the day for most. Still, there's going to be an extreme, reactionary nationalism, and if things aren't handled properly another war could be possible down the line.

Keep in mind the Dominion War devastated the Cardassian military and their civilian population and infrastructure. The civilian casualties in the wake of the Dominion's attempted genocide was (I believe) at 800 million as stated in Garak's last scene - and the casualty count was still going. Cardassia is essentially Germany after WWII - defeated, broken, and devastated. They don't just need help to rebuild - they require it. So they'll accept help from the Federation when it comes - and it will come - which will no doubt open the door to membership, if the Cardassians wish.

As for their history preventing them from joining the Federation... the Federation has never really been too concerned about a planet's past when considering them for membership, only their current societal and technological development. Hell, if they were that concerned about history, planets like Earth and Vulcan wouldn't be members.

I don't see the Romulans being affected by the war. As problematic as post-DS9 films have been, they bare out the idea that the Romulans have more defining issues within their own borders. The Federation's relationship with them remains precarious.

I think Sloan stated in "Intra Arma" whatever that the Romulans would be the biggest threat the Federation would face post-war. Of course, that probably didn't take into account Shinzon killing practically the entire Romulan government, whatever fallout from that once he was deposed, and the destruction of Romulus. I don't know where the novels have gone with this, but in Star Trek Online, it apparently led to a number of internal conflicts, culminating in Sela declaring herself Empress, the Tal Shiar gaining more political power... and the rise of a new republic under a member of Spock's underground Reunification movement.

[FaxModem1]

I'd rather see the post-war forces setting up a government that would make Cardassia the least likely to start more trouble, namely one modeled after the Fed.

Really, looking at what's left of Cardassia. They're really going to need the help rebuilding just to exist as a government, if not going extinct as a people. We're talking decades here before they're solid enough to do anything without the Federation propping them up. Making trouble will be hard, if not impossible, for them to do unless it's a century or more down the road. And by that time, they might be Federation allies, if not members. Could still be potential terrorist cells, as shown in Star Trek Online.

Klingon civil war I'd rather see breaking the empire apart into numerous warring nations, hopefully resulting in a permanent fracturing of the klingon race into several separate nations, something which Star Trek really, really needs to have given it's "One race, one nation" mentality.

Possible, but the Klingons tend to band together against outside threats, or if things are bad enough for the leadership and civil war is looming, they try to find one(see Gowron and the invasion of the Cardassian Empire). But, the real problem for the Klingons is that they've exhausted resources for the past two decades. A civil war, a failed invasion of Cardassian space, a conflict with the Federation, followed by a costly war with the Dominion. Martok is going to have problems keeping his chair, but a lot of Houses will be severely depleted from all the conflicts that they might just want to hold off until they have replenished their ranks a bit. Again, it might be a couple decades until that happens.

Then again, maybe Martok is challenged and killed, and the new Chancellor utterly destroys the Empire. *shrug*

It's not simply Nemesis the damaged the Romulans, the Star Trek remake had Spock heading to save their asses and he vanished. That result would be the destruction of Romulus when the Romulands relied on the Federation to help them, and on top of it all, it came down to a Vulcan helping them that wound up screwing things up.

They will not be doing anything close to being friendly with the Federation after that. I could see the Romulan Empire forming the main opposition to Federation hegemony in the Alpha Quadrant after that actively pushing to undermine them in anyway they can.

If the Romulan Empire can rebuild itself after that without Federation aid. Trek powers need their homeworlds to stay competitive, or have something resembling a functioning government. See Star Trek VI and the Klingons, the Cardassians after the destruction of Cardassia, every single Trek villain's plan to stop the Federation by taking out Earth, etc. The Romulan government might not be too friendly with the Federation, but then, as mentioned in the STO timeline, they might not have much choice.

Didn't that episode of Voyager 'relativity' kind of hint at this?

Star Trek has always had a triumphalist mentality when it came to the Federation.

It needs to be taken down a few pegs, and the Dominion War causing a "Vietnam Syndrome" of sorts as the Federation withdraws reluctant to get their hands dirty again as the AQ degenerates with the Klingon Empire disintegrating and the Romulans gunning to unravel their hegemony is a perfect setting for a post-Dominion War series to re-inject a sense of vulnerability back in their situation again.

I forget how much you hate the idealism of Star Trek and the idea of the Federation being a powerful government.

Vietnam is not an apt comparison for how the Federation should feel about the Dominion war. If anything, DS9 portrayed the Dominion War more as the Federation's stand-in as America in WWII, a giant fight for it's very survival against a great evil, which they won, and are now the sole standing power which is largely untouched in this(aside from the Romulans, who as you mentioned, go boom). They'll need to bury their dead, to rebuild, and fix things, of course.

The question now, is what happens to the Alpha Quadrant with the Federation as the dominating power? More than likely, there will be a focus on rebuilding the Federation planets that were invaded, such as Betazed(did the Dominion pay reparations as per the Treaty of Bajor, or did they just retreat to their quarter of the galaxy?), and probably help Cardassia rebuild, because it's both the right thing to do, and it makes sense politically, as it gains them an ally, and maybe even a future member.

A potential future series could be about dealing with political dissidents, refugees, moral conundrums on who to help rebuild first, etc. See the Federation trying to rebuild all the ashes of the Alpha Quadrant, with them being stretched thin having to do so, debates on what is the right thing to do, etc.

[CharlesPhipps]

I actually like the idea of the Federation being more cautious, conservative, and less prone to exploration after the Dominion War. It is the worst war the Federation has ever experienced and it's been through a really large number of them for a mostly peaceful organization.