So, Round 1 for the Second American Civil War happened today

[Captain Crimson]

You shouldn't be scared of Mr. 45, mind you, so much as what comes after him, because even if he got a second term, his power is limited. Regardless, he IS being removed from office come January, 2025 no matter what happens, as that is when his executive powers expire. It is why I laugh so hard when the leftist media speaks about a "constitutional crisis." How about just amending the bleeding thing? No, as I've said before, it's about cultural inertia, and what he's started could have severe blowback much further down the line. That's what you should be worried over, IMO.

Being in Kentucky provides a different perspective where Mitch McConnell has been known to dip into job approval ratings of 18% but the only people who have a chance to vote in our state are rich suburbanites. I'm also familiar with his tactics to decrease voter turnout, suppress alternative candidates, and outright cheat. I've seen Mitch support the opiod crisis, steal from teacher's pensions, overturn a vote to legalize pot by his own party, and attack my wife's medical coverage. He's a bad bad man. He's also in charge of everything these days.

Trump wouldn't be nearly as scary if not for the constant actions by people like the Governor of Georgia striking down 100K voters from the rolls and other blatantly illegal actions. Actions we know he won't be taken to task for because the United States Senate blatantly ignored an impeachable offense then acquitted him for it (despite doing much more against Bill Clinton). If they're willing to cheat and ignore criminal activities from the President, I'm not sure why I shouldn't be afraid.

Since you're missing my overall point. It hasn't been a true representative democracy in a long time, and even if it's on the road to becoming worse, that still takes time. Even four more years of Mr. 45 is not going to be enough, due to cultural inertia. The best and worst of our society outlives the four or eight-year terms of our elected executive chief. Anything he does now, is going to carry over.

[unknownsample]

I dunno, I think plotting to murder a governor and the families of police are a bit of an escalation versus no deaths with three empty precincts.

I'm shocked that so far no one has gone but what about antifa standards here it seems are slipping But seriously this is a very worrying incident and shows clearly the threat posed by far-right terrorists (Don't call them militias, call them what they are terrorists)

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

What a wishy-washy, centrist statement that fails to address the problem, CC.

Also these aren't a "militia", they're 100% terrorists.

The problem is you got leftist mayors who let civilians seize a police precinct, and then you got the right fomenting fringe hate groups that wanna go after the government.

Way to "both sides" a terrorist group trying to kidnap and execute a Governor in hopes of inspiring similar assassination plots.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

White supremacists could set off a nuke and announce that they did it on behalf of their glorious president, and Trump would just tweet in all caps "THE REAL PROBLEM IS ANTIFA AND THE LEFT-WING TERRORISTS!"

So would a lot of our forum posters.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

That's because our culture overall has become more liberal. When the right wing slowly realized over the years that a growing majority of Americans began to support pro-choice, legalization of marijuana, medicare for all, ending the wars, marriage equality & LGBTQ rights, etc, their reaction was to double down to moving even FURTHER to the right.

I often hear from commentators that if Trump loses this election the Republicans may never recover after this. I'm not sure if that's accurate, but it kind of feels like that.

Gods I hope so.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Yes, the funny thing is I used to be Republican but switched when after Hurricane Katrina there wasn't a damned bit of effort to rebuild that city. At that point I thought, "Maybe the Center isn't the best place to be if these guys are being assholes."

Then things there moved righter and righter and righter.

I may not have liked W. but I was never scared of him the way I am of Trump.

While I can concede the DNC being a better alternative, I think they don't deserve a pass. True, a lot of it you can pin on Mr. Dubya, but at the same time, they also shared their own role in the downfall of the New Economy that was touted as the future in the '90s.

You shouldn't be scared of Mr. 45, mind you, so much as what comes after him, because even if he got a second term, his power is limited. Regardless, he IS being removed from office come January, 2025 no matter what happens, as that is when his executive powers expire.

I don't trust like that.

[CharlesPhipps]

Since you're missing my overall point. It hasn't been a true representative democracy in a long time, and even if it's on the road to becoming worse, that still takes time. Even four more years of Mr. 45 is not going to be enough, due to cultural inertia. The best and worst of our society outlives the four or eight-year terms of our elected executive chief. Anything he does now, is going to carry over.

I get your point, I just disagree with it. It needs to become one and the only way we can make it so is by opposing tyranny and voter suppression.

[clearspira]

Since you're missing my overall point. It hasn't been a true representative democracy in a long time, and even if it's on the road to becoming worse, that still takes time. Even four more years of Mr. 45 is not going to be enough, due to cultural inertia. The best and worst of our society outlives the four or eight-year terms of our elected executive chief. Anything he does now, is going to carry over.

I get your point, I just disagree with it. It needs to become one and the only way we can make it so is by opposing tyranny and voter suppression.

I said earlier that Trump is a symptom not a cause, but what does that mean? It is easy to say such things without backing up what I think that means in reality.

I believe the single biggest problem in the entire world right now, and the one that fundamentally led to Trump (and Brexit, I am not putting myself on a pedestal), is loss of identity. There are deeply held values that have been forged over hundreds of years - values that you may not agree with - but values nonetheless that in a mere 20 to 30 years have been overshadowed or have been rendered obsolete. And that scares people. And angers people. And makes people do stupid things like vote for bad leaders.

There are heterosexuals and Christian fundamentalists who hate the fact that their perception of marriage has changed. There are patriots who stand for God and the American way who are now living in a world where what it means to be American is not what it used to be. There are miners and steel workers who sometimes are the fourth in their generation to work in that exact same village mine who are watching as AI and the green revolution has come along and made their profession a thing of the past. There are men who cannot stand to see a woman outrank them, there whites who feel the same about blacks.

That is the world we live in. It is a world that has changed to almost unrecognisable levels in the span of a single lifetime. Hell, black segregation is still within living memory. Or here in Britain, the castration of Alan Turing is still within living memory. The people who backed these acts did not merely vanish as we all hope they did, they merely went underground and festered.

THAT is why there will always be another Trump. The world is full of scared, angry and lost people who are looking for a shepherd and Trump managed to convince them that he was that shepherd. I'll tell you this much: Biden sure as hell is not the man to unite these people. He represents the status quo. What is the solution? Hell knows. I'm not smart enough to heal the world. My gut tells me that only when the old have died and the young have come forth will the world settle but I do not know.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

If I may double down on the despair, I'd say that the old dying out won't solve the problem. There are plenty of healthy young men ready to be radicalized and join the marches with tiki-torches shouting "Jews will not replace us!"

I don't know what will actually succeed, but I'm gonna try something to push back against it.

[CharlesPhipps]

I believe the single biggest problem in the entire world right now, and the one that fundamentally led to Trump (and Brexit, I am not putting myself on a pedestal), is loss of identity. There are deeply held values that have been forged over hundreds of years - values that you may not agree with - but values nonetheless that in a mere 20 to 30 years have been overshadowed or have been rendered obsolete. And that scares people. And angers people. And makes people do stupid things like vote for bad leaders.

This falls apart because my value is the equality of all people and hatred of white supremacy, misogyny, as well as the corruption of faith by the rich as well as powerful. These are the values I hold to be important and which I should die for.