Star Trek Discovery: Season Three

[Link8909]

And there were lots of little things I like in this episode, the ending with most of the bridge crew visiting the tree they used to study under at the academy now all grown up, that Earth is still a paradise, the memorial wall o lost crew members with Starfleet badges, Burnham and Book's banter, honestly a really good episode.

Absolutely this. Frankly, I think this right here is a good portent of what we can expect from S3 DISCO. There's been a lot of those little moments of human interactions, even starting with Michael in the first episode. I'm glad that the writers are choosing to put the humanity of the characters - even the non-human ones - first.

Interestingly, I also like that Saru and Michael recuse themselves from the Earth visit. While they are Federation and Starfleet, they're also not Earthers like the crew who go planetside. It's a significant place to them...but it's also not home.

Also, the bit at the memorial wall. "Tilly gonna Tilly" indeed. She's grown on me. Should I be worried?

I wouldn't worry, honestly for me Tilly has been the stand out character throughout all of Star Trek Discovery, her cheerful personality is always a joy to watch, and like you've said with what their doing with the characters in season three, she has always felt the most human from the start.

[Link8909]

I also like Burnham and her more "lighter" personality as Tilly put it, and It looks like Chuck is being proven wrong in one case so far, as aside from the tearful reunion with the crew, she mainly interacts with either Saru and Book this episode, with other characters having a chance to shine and interact with new characters, even with her being reintroduced as it were, with her now back onboard it'll be interesting to see how the series goes forth, also I agree, “Cake is eternal.”

I do agree that the lighter, more human personality is a welcome change, and helps Michael be more likable - something she desperately needs. Unfortunately I disagree that she allows other characters to shine. She hogs a significant amount of screen-time, is the one who "gives" Saru his command, even though that should be the crew's decision at this point (they really do have to choose to follow him - there is no Starfleet Command at this point to say, "this guy is in charge, follow him.") She also pulls off a Burnham Fastball Special - come up with a crazy plan, don't tell anyone about it, and hope it works. Hopefully that pitch isn't so fast that both the batter and the hitter can't react!

Interestingly, she shares this trait with Booker, who not only is prone to his own fastball specials, but sometimes pulls them off while drunk, apparently. She really should've gone with Booker, she's not a good fit for the Discovery.

I see what you mean, and It makes sense Burnham has more screen time this episode, as it essentially is reintroducing her, and maybe saying she gives others chances to shine wasn't the best description, I suppose that what I mean is that it isn't all about her, she doesn't have ten different relationship problems going at the same time, and she isn't the only one who can fix the problems, and that she wasn't responsible or apart of the major conflict of the season, and while it's still early to say weather they'll repeat the previous seasons trend or not, so far it looks like Burnham is more reacting to the conflict rather than the major driving force of it, and as you say, her more lighter personality, as well as so far cutting back on the unnecessary specification, makes her more enjoyable to watch.

I also see what you mean about her giving Captain Saru the Chair, I personally felt that was fine and even really great, as there really wasn't a debate about who should get it, and can then focus on Saru growing into the role, and I loved Saru's speech upon officially taking the Chair.

[Captain Crimson]

My biggest gripe so far is that while STD is turning around, it's still only in a controlled, corporate way that's not... it's not pushing any boundaries. I think comparisons to the olden days is somewhat disingenuous, for two reasons. One being that the launch to TNG didn't have as much backdrop as ST does now, so the past should be a learning experience, and the second being that BOBW was a major shake-up that, so far as I've read, just didn't happen back then, and so it changed the paradigm. Why hasn't Mr. Moore been allowed to return? He would do just that, and that is perhaps why. Or perhaps Mr. Jones? Again, probably that's why.

I think STD's start was still unacceptably rocky, but they've moved past that, which is good, and STP shows much greater promise, assuming they could ever get around to actually upbeat stories, and it's not all dreary and depressing reminders to the world we live in now from SJW leftists in their corporate echo chambers.

I give STD S3 so far 5/10. Which is actually pretty good compared to where it was, TBH. But if it is to sustain itself even short-term, it will need a major shake-up that BOBW did for both ST and TV itself. And I don't know if I foresee such a shake-up coming.

[Link8909]

My biggest gripe so far is that while STD is turning around, it's still only in a controlled, corporate way that's not... it's not pushing any boundaries. I think comparisons to the olden days is somewhat disingenuous, for two reasons. One being that the launch to TNG didn't have as much backdrop as ST does now, so the past should be a learning experience, and the second being that BOBW was a major shake-up that, so far as I've read, just didn't happen back then, and so it changed the paradigm. Why hasn't Mr. Moore been allowed to return? He would do just that, and that is perhaps why. Or perhaps Mr. Jones? Again, probably that's why.

I see what you mean with not trying to compare the current run to the previous era, and I feel that holding the older series in such overtly high regards is setting up any new entries to the franchise for failure in the eyes of a fan, and I do agree that in order to move Star Trek forward as a franchise is to try new things and take more risks, personally I feel Star Trek Picard does this very well with its premise alone of having Picard return, but not to Starfleet, and even Star Trek Lower Decks while heavily utilizing Star Trek lore is just as much stepping into unknown territory for the franchise by being a pure sitcom focusing on the least important ship and crew in the fleet, and Star Trek Discovery is now in complete unknown and really is being it's own thing from any Star Trek series.

I would also love to see not only new talent come in and try new things, but even have some of the old guard return and have then try their own unique things like with Jonathan Frakes.

I think Star Trek Discovery's start was still unacceptably rocky, but they've moved past that, which is good, and Star Trek Picard shows much greater promise, assuming they could ever get around to actually upbeat stories.

I feel Star Trek Discoverys issues can be attributed to too many cooks in the kitchen as it were, season one in particle has some interesting stories, but they weren't given enough time to expand on them, and while I love season one of Star Trek Picard, and personally I would say that the season was more melancholy than depressing, I would like to more upbeat moments from the series in the future, keep the slow pace and character interactions, but expand and have scenes like on Nepenthe or when Picard reunited with Hugh, and keep the darker moments to a minimum.

I give Star Trek Discovery S3 so far 5/10. Which is actually pretty good compared to where it was, TBH. But if it is to sustain itself even short-term, it will need a major shake-up that BOBW did for both ST and TV itself. And I don't know if I foresee such a shake-up coming.

To be honest, I also don't see this kind of shake-up happening as well unless Star Trek does something really out there, but it's not for lack of trying on the part of the creative team, rather that as you said, Star Trek now has this huge history behind it, and I say Star Trek can be anything because there are so many episodes that have done so many different types and styles of story telling, and that television has evolved not only when Star Trek was running, but has come along was since it was off the air and is now sort of playing catch-up with what modern shows have been doing for years now.

[Captain Crimson]

I see what you mean with not trying to compare the current run to the previous era, and I feel that holding the older series in such overtly high regards is setting up any new entries to the franchise for failure in the eyes of a fan, and I do agree that in order to move Star Trek forward as a franchise is to try new things and take more risks, personally I feel Star Trek Picard does this very well with its premise alone of having Picard return, but not to Starfleet, and even Star Trek Lower Decks while heavily utilizing Star Trek lore is just as much stepping into unknown territory for the franchise by being a pure sitcom focusing on the least important ship and crew in the fleet, and Star Trek Discovery is now in complete unknown and really is being it's own thing from any Star Trek series.

I would also love to see not only new talent come in and try new things, but even have some of the old guard return and have then try their own unique things like with Jonathan Frakes.

In some ways, STD was doomed from the start, so its upward spiral is in spite of itself, which makes STP a far worse endeavor, you could argue. Which is ironic since it has a far stronger start than STD did and a clear attempt to fit within the PT as opposed to taking a wrecking ball to it because they wanna write for the reboots, which is all they know.

While the ideas certainly merit admission of worth, at the same time, it's definitely not how a fan would have handled it, if they had had some kinda lore team like SF had in the past. Plus the way the new creators only want SJWs as fans, no one else. My takeaway is the animated shows are doing a lot better than the live-action ones, and there's many factors you could attribute to this slump, but for whatever reason, it's the new norm.

I think it is that Mr. Moore would not conduct himself as a spineless Hollywood insider, which is what the managers want. Or those saying "the wrong things." It's become a real issue in the entertainment sphere right now. Plus the nonstop exporting of American culture to China so that they can set us up for propaganda purposes. Really just more outsourcing.

I feel Star Trek Discoverys issues can be attributed to too many cooks in the kitchen as it were, season one in particle has some interesting stories, but they weren't given enough time to expand on them, and while I love season one of Star Trek Picard, and personally I would say that the season was more melancholy than depressing, I would like to more upbeat moments from the series in the future, keep the slow pace and character interactions, but expand and have scenes like on Nepenthe or when Picard reunited with Hugh, and keep the darker moments to a minimum.

Or are those just hollow defense-rationalizations from a generation of increasingly weaker writers who are now ill-educated in the liberal arts so much as business and Big Tech sensibilities in the wake of the New Economy? CGI provides just such a backdrop, as do many other excesses in today's bloated corporate entertainment sphere. Again, for an older-running continuity, you need to have a plan from the start, and it's not like it's so hard. B5 showed it could be done. They have not.

While people have a difficult time expressing themselves, the assertion "it's less scientific" despite ST's history is not invalid. The total absence toward the understanding of even basic science by the management team, even if it doesn't translate to the final work, leaves you with a less clever story than it could be. Not to the levels of Mr. Braga, certainly, but far from the glory days of classic ST and even SF. Will we get that back? I don't know.

Well, that's to your subjective interpretation, of course, but it felt depressing to me because it's a reminder to many real-world problems, that we've already explored more creatively in ST before, and that all came prior to 9/11. If you're not an SJW, it sucks to be you! You're not who they want as fans. Or the Chinese. Why can't we have timeless social themes if you're so H-bent on making it all social? It feels more hamfisted than ever due to the blacklisting of conservatives in Hollywood, as these shows are really only made for the left now, not by the left. Plus all the modern trends are present. It needs to be edgy, and kill off main characters randomly for no reason, and much more.

To be honest, I also don't see this kind of shake-up happening as well unless Star Trek does something really out there, but it's not for lack of trying on the part of the creative team, rather that as you said, Star Trek now has this huge history behind it, and I say Star Trek can be anything because there are so many episodes that have done so many different types and styles of story telling, and that television has evolved not only when Star Trek was running, but has come along was since it was off the air and is now sort of playing catch-up with what modern shows have been doing for years now.

Plus management toadies pushing it the way they want it. Whatever his personal life, you have to hand it to Mr. Roddenberry, as he set out to make something for the fans. Same with Mr. Lucas. That's just absent from Hollywood now and to get called out has accusations pushed on you for being part of "toxic fandom." Bringing back Sir Patrick Stewart was the classic nostalgia trap, as it would have been far easier to set it a century later. Even ENT had more breathing room being a hundred years earlier.

Look at where we are now. I'm a huge retro junkie, and comparing music, fashion, cars, TV and movies, and the cornerstones of American culture are vanishing. Any car looks the same now, as do many fashions, and practically every factory-churned corporate piece of entertainment. There is no flourishes and art to society anymore, and that's honestly what I think I miss most about coming to age in the 21st century and not the 20th.

[Asvarduil]

So, just got done with S3E5. While this episode was a lot "quieter" in some ways, with fewer "big" reveals (other than seeing Trill for the first time), I feel like there were structural changes in this episode that are only for the better.

First, Michael. This episode was a good, if only mildly hamfisted, way of handling her. She's the main character, so it'd make sense that Science Commando Burnham would take the reigns on the A-plot. Alteratively, Saru feared keeping her on the ship would expose them all to another "Burnham Fastball Special", which is a legitimate fear on the DISCO. I imagine every poor ensign - including Tilly - fears Michael getting one of her "brilliant" ideas.

Our new character, Adira, was delightfully understated, interestingly enough. The whole "connect to the symbiont" thing was an interesting way to explain their backstory - again, if hamfisted - and the conflict makes their eventual union with the Atal symbiont the more powerful. Additionally, the whole concept that the memory of their lover will live on alongside them until basically the end of their life.

The dinner on the DISCO, though, was particularly good. Frankly, Detmer needed to blow her top. She's been cooler than an ice cube in Antarctica, and her little freak out was a long time in coming. She's been through a lot, granted, but she's not made of stone. Additionally, Mirror Georgiou gonna Mirror Georgiou.

It's also very rare that we get a Chief Medical Officer's log as the start to an episode.

My verdict on S3E5? It's a good episode that is clearly building for S3E6. It's as powerful as it needs to be, handles all characters well, and really sets the tone for what's going on. I think that - for once the writers did if not a good job, at least a passable one.

[Thebestoftherest]

Hopefully they don't let Micheal smother the plot.

[Link8909]

So, just got done with S3E5. While this episode was a lot "quieter" in some ways, with fewer "big" reveals (other than seeing Trill for the first time), I feel like there were structural changes in this episode that are only for the better.

First, Michael. This episode was a good, if only mildly hamfisted, way of handling her. She's the main character, so it'd make sense that Science Commando Burnham would take the reigns on the A-plot. Alteratively, Saru feared keeping her on the ship would expose them all to another "Burnham Fastball Special", which is a legitimate fear on the DISCO. I imagine every poor ensign - including Tilly - fears Michael getting one of her "brilliant" ideas.

Our new character, Adira, was delightfully understated, interestingly enough. The whole "connect to the symbiont" thing was an interesting way to explain their backstory - again, if hamfisted - and the conflict makes their eventual union with the Atal symbiont the more powerful. Additionally, the whole concept that the memory of their lover will live on alongside them until basically the end of their life.

The dinner on the DISCO, though, was particularly good. Frankly, Detmer needed to blow her top. She's been cooler than an ice cube in Antarctica, and her little freak out was a long time in coming. She's been through a lot, granted, but she's not made of stone. Additionally, Mirror Georgiou gonna Mirror Georgiou.

It's also very rare that we get a Chief Medical Officer's log as the start to an episode.

My verdict on S3E5? It's a good episode that is clearly building for S3E6. It's as powerful as it needs to be, handles all characters well, and really sets the tone for what's going on. I think that - for once the writers did if not a good job, at least a passable one.

Pretty much agree, I really enjoyed "Forget Me Not" myself, I particularly like that Adira Tal now has her lover Gray Tal appearing to her and I look forward to seeing more, and overall how the Trill and how the symbiont were presented, the scenes in the cave and inside Adira mind were beautiful, I also really liked the dinner scenes as well, also I like that Discovery's computer is becoming sentient, and setting up to "Calypso".

[Zargon]

So, just got done with S3E5.

Well, new special character Adira Tal gets mostly her own episode...with Michael as the whole show must always be about Mikey. That is much more then we got then all the unknown nameless characters at the dinner table.

So............why do Adira and Michael take a shuttle down to Trill? Was the transpoerter broken? Or did the bad lazy writer just need a dumb excuse for them stay on the planet and not just transport away in a couple seconds.

So, um mushroom man doctor #3, gives the crew a physical or such......but, um, his tech and his, um, common sense can't tell if there are things wrong with people? Demeter would have shown at least "elevated levels of x", right?

And wow....we see more of the worst captain, maybe worst person, is all of Star Trek: blockhead Saru. Wow, poor guy can't figure out why the crew is sad. So he...er...asks the computer what to do?

Geee, tyrant idiot Saru maybe the crew might have been a tiny little bit more happy if you could have given them more then ten seconds of shore leave on Earth. You know where everyone ran over to "the tree" and like three seconds later tyrant Saru calls was like "ok time to go". Gee would spending a whole day on Earth be too much to ask....guess so.

Oh...and the Dinner. So...Saru, channeling the worst bosses ever picks favorites to join him for dinner. And sure he picks all the nameless bridge crew, most of who are NOT even main characters on the show. (who Is the blonde woman anyway, she just showed up right?) (and what is Sauran Bob's job anyway?) But oddly, he does not have Michael come......weird as she is part of the "family" and everyone loves her. So...sure both Stamis and Demeter both have "crazy sub plots" going so they fight....and er, all the other people just sit and eat? But then when the two crazy people stomp out like brats....everyone else runs too....for no reason?


So...........where does Adira get her musical instrument from? Disco does not have replicators. Is there a music shop on the ship? Or was the idea she used a replicator on Trill?

[CharlesPhipps]

DISCO has replicators as we saw in the episode with Craft.