Star Trek Discovery: Season Three

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

I think the information age changes a lot of stuff too.

I like what Steven Colbert said when he left the Colbert report, something along the lines of 'We're not really at a place now where Obama's middle name isn't the hugest of concerns.'

[Makeshift Python]

STD having a fourth season being a sign of success means that you first have to explain to me why ENT's fourth season killing off the franchise for years isn't also a sign of success.

Your logic just defeated itself. DISCO has expanded Star Trek and revived it on television.

So, by your logic, it's a huge success.

Jesus, clearspira, this needs to be said. Please....CAN YOU JUST HATE THE SHOW? Stop trying to argue it's a bomb, just say it sucks!

No one will blame you for it!

That's the thing about dorks like clearspiras and doomcocks. It's not enough that a show sucks, it needs to be an unmitigated failure at every level, and they'll look for any angle to portray it as such.

I think this all started when angry nerds started throwing out terms like "objective opinion", where it wasn't enough to just not like something, they had to look for a way to say it was factually/objectively bad, as if it's something that can't be possibly disputed. It shows how fucking childish and insecure they are.

[Link8909]

That's the thing about dorks like clearspiras and doomcocks. It's not enough that a show sucks, it needs to be an unmitigated failure at every level, and they'll look for any angle to portray it as such.

I think this all started when angry nerds started throwing out terms like "objective opinion", where it wasn't enough to just not like something, they had to look for a way to say it was factually/objectively bad, as if it's something that can't be possibly disputed. It shows how fucking childish and insecure they are.

Agreed, it's also the problem with believing in a conspiracy, they think they're right and everyone is wrong because of selected points that are blown out of proportion, and even when more facts, context, and reason are presented, they either ignore them and are considered lies, or another part of the conspiracy to add.

[Link8909]

Again, it's ALWAYS been hamfisted and directly in your face.

TNG especially:

"DRUGS BAD!"

"Vietnam veterans should be treated well!"

"Gay people should not be forced to give up their sexual identity."

"Forcing Native people off land is terrible!"

"Old people should not be forced to die because they've reached an arbitrary age."

Now if you're going to argue with me on these, let me screw with you. How many of you know the episodes these are referring to just by these descriptions?"

I rest my case.

And here's where it gets DOUBLY frustrating. DISCO hasn't done ANYTHING remotely as political. In fact, it's like a hundred times LESS political than most Star Trek because it's mostly pew-pew, bang bang but that doesn't fit the criticism that its detractors WANT to throw at it.

They want to complain about social justice and so on so they pretend it's full of message episodes versus fighting insane AI and mustache twirling bald Klingons.

That's what ticks me off because they are using it as an example of their own agenda--fighting perceived Left bias even though it's not remotely an accurate description.

Hmm, that actually an interesting point.

Indeed.

[Thebestoftherest]

Again, it's ALWAYS been hamfisted and directly in your face.

TNG especially:

"DRUGS BAD!"

"Vietnam veterans should be treated well!"

"Gay people should not be forced to give up their sexual identity."

"Forcing Native people off land is terrible!"

"Old people should not be forced to die because they've reached an arbitrary age."

Now if you're going to argue with me on these, let me screw with you. How many of you know the episodes these are referring to just by these descriptions?"

I rest my case.

And here's where it gets DOUBLY frustrating. DISCO hasn't done ANYTHING remotely as political. In fact, it's like a hundred times LESS political than most Star Trek because it's mostly pew-pew, bang bang but that doesn't fit the criticism that its detractors WANT to throw at it.

They want to complain about social justice and so on so they pretend it's full of message episodes versus fighting insane AI and mustache twirling bald Klingons.

That's what ticks me off because they are using it as an example of their own agenda--fighting perceived Left bias even though it's not remotely an accurate description.

Hmm, that actually an interesting point.

Indeed.

Would it work if Micheal had to deal with a bigot in season 3 or 4?

[Captain Crimson]

Just remember that "failure" is subjective. It's what I'd said, the end of the monoculture, that as many fans grow to like STD and STP, primarily Zoomers, casuals, SJWs, and whatever other stripe of fandom you can name (I certainly probably haven't covered all of them), it is a success for them, many more will not, grow to hate it, it is not a success for them since it's made in the sterile corporate age of entertainment we have now, so that the atmosphere is more plain than ever it's being made to bring back big bucks to the studio suits no matter the cost, and as the decades pass and the lore keeps on building, it's going to break down. Remember that the fans are not the ones making this, or at the very least the corporations are smothering their imagination. The dividing line between fandom is thinner than ever, and I think that's what upsets fans like this.

It's why I'm so against copyright extensions, since an older IP has to eventually enter the public domain. Look at Disney's greedy hold over Mickey Mouse. Does anyone really expect Mickey to enter the public domain in 2024? No, I don't buy it. Public domain has two tangible benefits, in that it breathes new life into the product, and that it helps the economy, since fans are making it, the consumers have a direct hand in the material made for them and it's more competitive, unlike the ruthless anti-competitive leftist corporations today. We need to break up the American monopolies, because they're killing creativity, but I hold little doubt that's going to happen. To be clear, I'm not advocating for something to be put into public domain all at once, just that as it stands now, the people deserve it at some point given that we are their customers, their consumers, and when you read totally insane corporate articles advising businesses not to try and please their customers, you facepalm. Why should I give you my business if you won't listen to me?

Just don't write off clearspira's viewpoint, because I think the opinion of fans like that is far larger than you believe. Even something well-written and beloved like Stargate SG-1 had very low numbers compared to the larger population, the same as TCW, and TCW had actually shed viewers. It's just you don't see their viewpoints very often in certain circles online past the loud haters. You also see a lot of the love of the new fans, and yet, it's very tenuous, as I had said, since what happened to the older generation is eventually coming for them, as well. The only difference between the older fans versus the younger fans is that the Zoomers don't know it.

On the bright side, improving technology and digital tools probably means it's becoming easier and easier for fans to tell their own stories set within these universes and at a minimum of cost, material like the UE and deep-faking. It's going to cause horrible social repercussions, but will maximize new creative freedom, and provide a real challenge to the corporations. At that stage, they will just wind up splintering apart and reforming as the paradigm shifts. Maybe then they'll step up their game, or possibly they just collapse, who can say.

[CharlesPhipps]

Would it work if Micheal had to deal with a bigot in season 3 or 4?

She's a human being. The Logic Extremists were right that she and Spock are threats to their way of life.

[Thebestoftherest]

Would it work if Micheal had to deal with a bigot in season 3 or 4?

She's a human being. The Logic Extremists were right that she and Spock are threats to their way of life.

fair.

[clearspira]

Would it work if Micheal had to deal with a bigot in season 3 or 4?

She's a human being. The Logic Extremists were right that she and Spock are threats to their way of life.

I cannot remember a point in which Spock and Tuvok were not the only two friendly Vulcans in Star Trek. They were dicks in ENT, Sarek and every female Vulcan we see in TOS are dicks, they were Maquis members, serial killers or arrogant baseball players in DS9, bullies in the Abramsverse.

''Their way of life'' is the Vulcan way of life period.

[CharlesPhipps]

I cannot remember a point in which Spock and Tuvok were not the only two friendly Vulcans in Star Trek. They were dicks in ENT, Sarek and every female Vulcan we see in TOS are dicks, they were Maquis members, serial killers or arrogant baseball players in DS9, bullies in the Abramsverse.

''Their way of life'' is the Vulcan way of life period.

Don't forget Sarek.

To be fair, I remind you that this is the product of TOS not later seasons. Everyone assumes Spock is the typical Vulcan but our first exposure to Vulcans other than him is the discovery that they practice ritualized murder and sex duels. Spock is what you get when you have the Vulcans Dark Side removed due to Federation values.