Sfdebris fallout 3

[clearspira]

By far the most ham-fisted "evil" faction is Caesars Legion - and it didn't have to be.

Aside from the issues mentioned by others the Legion suffers by far the most from the rushed release date Obsidian got screwed by as like some stupid percentage of their planned content got cut. Some of it is still in the files and there's been mods aimed to try to get them at least somewhere compared to what they should have been

Eh, I don't think it would benefit from trying to make it sympathetic. There's nothing remotely unbelievable about the Legion and it acts a lot like plenty of RL warlords, even to the point of kidnapping children and indoctrinating them into extremist religion while engaged in large scale sexual slavery.

They're a lot believable than the Enclave in many ways.

Why make the evil faction less visceral?

Yeah, the Legion in a way is the most realistic faction of all. After the apocalypse, after government and law breaks down, after every drop of water becomes precious; the strong will rule. Just as they did in ancient times. And that most likely means men in charge, women second and whichever "other" in third.

Not the only possibility of course. But it really isn't a coincidence that the rise of liberalism and equality is directly proportional to the availability of food, shelter, resources and money. It's amazing what a packed supermarket can do for tolerance.

Slavery is also a real possibility. The elite won't want to plow a field by hand because the elite tend to be above manual work, and if there are not enough citizens to do it, winter is coming and there is a weak village nearby... well, all I'm saying is that is how justifications start.

[CharlesPhipps]

Yeah, the Legion in a way is the most realistic faction of all. After the apocalypse, after government and law breaks down, after every drop of water becomes precious; the strong will rule. Just as they did in ancient times. And that most likely means men in charge, women second and whichever "other" in third.

Not the only possibility of course. But it really isn't a coincidence that the rise of liberalism and equality is directly proportional to the availability of food, shelter, resources and money. It's amazing what a packed supermarket can do for tolerance.

Slavery is also a real possibility. The elite won't want to plow a field by hand because the elite tend to be above manual work, and if there are not enough citizens to do it, winter is coming and there is a weak village nearby... well, all I'm saying is that is how justifications start.

The Legion is basically the Taliban. It's just the irony of it being surrounded by tribal societies its conquering and raping is contrasted to the larger egalitarian militarily superior society (NCR) as well as the local power that has emerged (House).

And the Legion is like most fascists in that it is incredibly broken and inefficient but they're dangerous due to how much of a bunch of psychos they are.

[Thebestoftherest]

By far the most ham-fisted "evil" faction is Caesars Legion - and it didn't have to be.

Aside from the issues mentioned by others the Legion suffers by far the most from the rushed release date Obsidian got screwed by as like some stupid percentage of their planned content got cut. Some of it is still in the files and there's been mods aimed to try to get them at least somewhere compared to what they should have been

Eh, I don't think it would benefit from trying to make it sympathetic. There's nothing remotely unbelievable about the Legion and it acts a lot like plenty of RL warlords, even to the point of kidnapping children and indoctrinating them into extremist religion while engaged in large scale sexual slavery.

They're a lot believable than the Enclave in many ways.

Why make the evil faction less visceral?

Yeah, the Legion in a way is the most realistic faction of all. After the apocalypse, after government and law breaks down, after every drop of water becomes precious; the strong will rule. Just as they did in ancient times. And that most likely means men in charge, women second and whichever "other" in third.

Not the only possibility of course. But it really isn't a coincidence that the rise of liberalism and equality is directly proportional to the availability of food, shelter, resources and money. It's amazing what a packed supermarket can do for tolerance.

Slavery is also a real possibility. The elite won't want to plow a field by hand because the elite tend to be above manual work, and if there are not enough citizens to do it, winter is coming and there is a weak village nearby... well, all I'm saying is that is how justifications start.

They regret superior technology, and medicine. That might be realistic but that not something that will last the test of time.

[FaxModem1]

They regret superior technology, and medicine. That might be realistic but that not something that will last the test of time.

Unfortunately, they don't have to last the test of time. They can sweep across the American southwest, removing technology, rationality, tolerance, and continue doing so, and if no one can stop, that puts the rebuilding of civilization and continued suffering of the local populations for another generation as the Legion eventually tears itself apart.

[CharlesPhipps]

Unfortunately, they don't have to last the test of time. They can sweep across the American southwest, removing technology, rationality, tolerance, and continue doing so, and if no one can stop, that puts the rebuilding of civilization and continued suffering of the local populations for another generation as the Legion eventually tears itself apart.

Rebuilding the Old World as was is impossible because all the resources that would allow it like coal, oil, and more were exhausted pre-Nuclear War. The reason everything remaining is nuclear powered is because nuclear material is the only energy source still working after a century or so. The thing is that the Roman legion discarding all of the knowledge of the past means that finding anything alternative becomes impossible. Then it'll be a 1000 year Dark Age, assuming it ends at all.

[Independent George]

They regret superior technology, and medicine. That might be realistic but that not something that will last the test of time.

Really, it only works in the first place because it's a game where you can tank a half-dozen rifle shots and whack a guy with a machete, then drink a healing potion to recover your HP.

It actually occurs to me that someone might have requested a 'dumb' playthrough of FNV. While there are some hilarious dialogue options for that, I hope not because it really limits the playthrough.

[Thebestoftherest]

They regret superior technology, and medicine. That might be realistic but that not something that will last the test of time.

Really, it only works in the first place because it's a game where you can tank a half-dozen rifle shots and whack a guy with a machete, then drink a healing potion to recover your HP.

It actually occurs to me that someone might have requested a 'dumb' playthrough of FNV. While there are some hilarious dialogue options for that, I hope not because it really limits the playthrough.

The only reason the legion isn't whqck a mole to the NCR is the element of surprises and superior numbers which they won't have for long.

[clearspira]

They regret superior technology, and medicine. That might be realistic but that not something that will last the test of time.

Really, it only works in the first place because it's a game where you can tank a half-dozen rifle shots and whack a guy with a machete, then drink a healing potion to recover your HP.

It actually occurs to me that someone might have requested a 'dumb' playthrough of FNV. While there are some hilarious dialogue options for that, I hope not because it really limits the playthrough.

The only reason the legion isn't whqck a mole to the NCR is the element of surprises and superior numbers which they won't have for long.

Well... the NCR is effectively a World War 1 army without tanks, artillery, logistical support, battleships, submarines and aircraft (apart from one vertibird that only the president uses).

Whilst the real life empires of Europe proved very effectively happens when guns go up against spear, its also true that the Legion isn't just armed with spears. They also have hunting rifles, shotguns, and the odd dirty bomb.

Honestly, the odds are much more even than it at first seems.

[CharlesPhipps]

The only reason the legion isn't whqck a mole to the NCR is the element of surprises and superior numbers which they won't have for long.

To correct a misconception, the Legion may include melee fighters but the lore versions are all carrying guns.

It's not THAT dumb.

Besides, Caesar is happy to use a dirty bomb and chemical weapons.

[Rocketboy1313]

The Legion really forms another good criticism for the Enclave in 3.

The Enclave is ALL ABOUT having better technology, so much so that the Brotherhood (trapped in their own mode of thinking) are worried that the Enclave will kick their teeth in.

And that boxed in thinking is present in Vegas in the Brotherhood who can't figure out why the NCR hasn't won already... and that is odd because they have to understand concepts like belief and valor that allow the Legion to just fight harder and be more brutal than the NCR can really handle.