King Kong vs. Godzilla Review and History

[cdrood]

I grew up with the dub of this movie and enjoyed it, but never considered the Kong in this film to be the "real" King Kong. I always considered it the Japanese version, distinct from the original. First, the difference in scale is obvious. I can't speak for the original language, but the dub made it clear electricity increase Kong's strength, which to me further separated it from the original. Yes, even as child, the building climb shout out was disappointing. I do wonder if the 1976 version borrowed the Kong as corporate symbol idea from this film.

As an American, I did kind of root for Kong, but never bought that he was a match for Godzilla. Rock throwing doesn't stand up to atomic breath.

I think the problem with excessive comedy and even some of the over acting in these films is it really makes you hate all these people. At some point, the antics make you wonder why these people don't take the enormous threat seriously. It's not something like Die Hard, where jokes are used to cut the tension and help the protagonist from letting the situation overwhelm him. That's where comedy works in action/horror/etc. When they are clearly buffoons operating in a different reality from the people actually dealing with the potential deaths of thousands, it's off putting.

[cdrood]

I was a little confused by the joke about the main characters explorer outfits being associated with smallpox blankets. I'm guessing they're associated with the European colonization of Africa? Still, when I see those outfits the first thing I think is less "exploiting the natives" and more "cheap Halloween costume" or "whatever a character in a 90's kids show would wear when they're supposed to be in a jungle".

When the British colonized North America (this was before the American Revolution), they gave some Indians blankets that carried smallpox. The Indians through the Ohio Valley and Great Lakes area fell victim to a really nasty smallpox plague. Whether the blankets did it or not is in question, but the intent seemed to be there.

Though it should likely be noted that disease during that time was believed to be caused by Miasma as just what caused diseases and how they spread weren't really understood back then and wouldn't be until the latter part of the nineteenth century.

That being said the outfit was something more associated with british efforts in Africa in the 19th century as others have likely pointed out rather than anything in the British's american efforts.

Not enough armor and swords or multi-pointed hats to be british explorers of the Americas gear.

A good example is that the idea of surgeons washing their hands before surgery didn't start until the 1840's. It came when a doctor tried to figure why one clinic had higher infant death rates than another despite using the same procedures. It came down to one clinic was for training midwives, who don't do surgeries and autopsies, and the other was for doctors who do those tasks.

[Darth Wedgius]

I was a little confused by the joke about the main characters explorer outfits being associated with smallpox blankets. I'm guessing they're associated with the European colonization of Africa? Still, when I see those outfits the first thing I think is less "exploiting the natives" and more "cheap Halloween costume" or "whatever a character in a 90's kids show would wear when they're supposed to be in a jungle".

When the British colonized North America (this was before the American Revolution), they gave some Indians blankets that carried smallpox. The Indians through the Ohio Valley and Great Lakes area fell victim to a really nasty smallpox plague. Whether the blankets did it or not is in question, but the intent seemed to be there.

Though it should likely be noted that disease during that time was believed to be caused by Miasma as just what caused diseases and how they spread weren't really understood back then and wouldn't be until the latter part of the nineteenth century.

That being said the outfit was something more associated with british efforts in Africa in the 19th century as others have likely pointed out rather than anything in the British's american efforts.

Not enough armor and swords or multi-pointed hats to be british explorers of the Americas gear.

All true!

[vncredleader]

It was really neat to hear Chuck talk about the Ainu. They story is depressing, but also fascinating particularly in terms of human diaspora. Trey the Explainer did an amazing video on them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFohbr7ALeQ

Also I adore the end of the background vid, I think that dilemma is all too real and is a good reminder for us geeks and nerds that hey these things can be art, and be fucking hysterical. Its why I love the Silver Age, it can be utter nonsense that knows what it is and just tries to make you smile; and it can genuinely tell some fascinating stories with no limits on imagination.

I hate to be the history nitpick over a throwaway sentence, but Chuck missed the mark in his introduction video when he talked about the war between Poland and the Soviet Union. Lenin's motivation in invading Poland was not to reclaim Polish territories because they had formerly been part of the Russian Empire under the Tsars, but to try to link up with the developing revolutionary movement in Germany. He hoped Soviet troops could help bring about victory to the German Spartacists and alter the political landscape of Europe in favor of communism.

The war did not begin with the Soviet invasion of Poland, but actually with a Polish invasion of Soviet Union with the Kiev Offensive. Josef Pilsudski, the leader of Poland, wanted to create an intermarium (międzymorze) confederation of states along the lines and territory of the old Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, spanning from the Baltic Sea to the Black Sea, including the Baltic states and Ukraine. The Poles invaded the Soviet Union in April in support of the already defeated Ukrainian nationalist Symon Petlura (in fact Poland had gone to war with an independent Ukraine over in 1918-19). The Poles were beaten back, at which point the Soviets decided to pursue them into Poland with the aim of reaching Germany, but were defeated outside Warsaw in 1920.

(One could could draw, broadly speaking, comparisons between that conflict and what happened in the Korean War: with North Korea invading South Korea, then the Americans deciding not to stop after pushing Northern forces back to the 38th parallel, but driving on into North Korea itself, advancing all the way to the Yalu River--at which point the Chinese intervened and forced the Americans back to the 38th parallel).

Still it was a rich, fascinating life Chuck described.

Thank you for clarifying all of that. I am not super well versed on the inter-war years, but when Chuck was describing the conflict I was trying to remember the specifics since I know the back and forth was a lot more complicated than us Americans like to make it out to be. Particularly overlooking both the socialist movement in Germany, and the Kiev offensive quite often.

I was not aware of the attempt to resurrect the Polish-Lithuania Commonwealth. Funny that it sorta resembles something akin in the Russian Empire's dreams of a Pan-Slavic entity at the turn of the century. I sympathize with the Slavs on a lot of issues, but I think in America we have a fixation on making revolutions into "giant evil empire who is imperialist vs small state fighting solely for individual independence. I don't even mean this in a both sides sense, simply that even if one wholly agrees with one side, there is still the fact that nationalism and attempts at one's own imperialistic interests are so often at the forefront.

It is like the Baltic Wars, even with legit grievances, even if you fully agree with the actions of the nations involved (which is very understandable), the overall goal by each state was their own expansion. Serbia had reason to gain independence, but the push to do so was indivisible from the nationalistic goal of expansion. They grew their territory, gained a feeling of invincibility due to their impressive military victories, and pushed the Greater Serbian ideology with massacres of thousands of Albanian civilians.

Long tangent short, I think even more than broad oversimplifications of history, Americans have a particular tendency to put things in a context of revolution vs tyranny. Essentially solidifying our national myth of idealistic revolution, without addressing how much of it was ideology, and how much was replacing one empire with another. When a rival power fights against a revolution, they are oppressing proxies of us, but when a revolution opposes our interests, it is chaotic evil.

So even if one has fair reasons for supporting such conflicts like the Balkan wars (which there are), we almost need to put it in a context that justifies our revolution and strokes our ego. Whilst not accepting that accepting that notion opens the door for having to address the Philippine-American War. So genuine grassroots revolutions are ignored, but nationalism vs a large power is simplified to "pure idealistic revolution"

I just started a flame-war didnt I? I am less making a judgment on these specific conflicts, and more-so talking about how American History tends to frame them hypocritically

[Jclark]

Let us also never forget the greatest scene in cinematic history.

youtu.be/8eXgDT5GMRY
EAT YOUR FRUITS AND VEGETABLES!

[Mecha82]

Let us also never forget the greatest scene in cinematic history.

youtu.be/8eXgDT5GMRY
EAT YOUR FRUITS AND VEGETABLES!

Greater than Godzilla drop kicking Megalon with help of his tail from Godzilla vs. Megalon?

[s955120]

As some one who understand Japanese. The subtitle in this movie are really F-up....

Oh? Can you give some examples?

For example, in 24:06, the subtitle said "We must make it clear that King Kong is a real animal, whereas Godzilla is a monster born from radiation."
But the radio is actually saying: "Dr. Shigesawa speculate that King Kong, basing on its animal instinct, had detected Godzilla and are moving towards it."

In 25:16, the subtitle said "Damn... He's getting mad at Godzilla." while he was really saying: "Damn... it looks like Godzilla is stronger after all."

The ending line in 33:25, the Doctor mention noting about "change how we treat plants and animals." He just said human can learn from how plants and animals were adapting natural environment.

The scene in 19:02, the dialogue actually goes more like this: "We will have a (advertisement) photo with King Kong holding our company's product and laughing."
"Did King Kong even laugh?"
"Will, he probably will laugh for us. The catch phrase should be.... 'I took down Godzilla because I drink medicine from Pacific Pharmaceuticals...' maybe 'by the help from...' or 'with the medicine from...' which (preposition) sound best to you?"
Even Chuck notice there must be something wrong with the translation in this scene.

I'm not Japanese, and had some problem understand some faster dialogue, but some of these examples are quite basic for even an amateur like me can pick them up.

[ChrisTheLovableJerk]

Let us also never forget the greatest scene in cinematic history.

youtu.be/8eXgDT5GMRY
EAT YOUR FRUITS AND VEGETABLES!

Greater than Godzilla drop kicking Megalon with help of his tail from Godzilla vs. Megalon?

Greater than the time Godzilla randomly could fly for no reason?

[Deledrius]

fun fact; the name 'Mr. Tako' literally translates to 'Mr. Octopus'. and seeing as he works for a pharmaceutical company, i wonder if he has some sort of doctorate.

I was expecting it to be foreshadowing, as Kong defeats the octopus in the beginning, but Mr. Tako's role in the story (so far as I see in the review) is mostly just to get the show rolling and isn't directly "defeated" in his business dealings by Kong's actions. Aside from the whole thing just being a wash, I suppose.

[griffeytrek]

A small yet subtly hilarious detail that I had never noticed until watching Chuck's review. In the scene where the Pharmacy guys are caught sneaking around by the Army as they are facing off against the monsters, the Army guys are carrying these weird looking bazooka's, with what any Fallout player can easily recognize stuck on the end.

Yes viewers, to boost the Giligan's Island vibe up to the thermonuclear level, the infantry are running around with "Davy Crockett's"! The US's short lived and thankfully never used Nuclear Bazookas. Otherwise known as the "stupidest weapon ever devised by man!" Granted these were the advanced models, and a vast improvement over the "thermonuclear hand grenade".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Davy_Croc ... ar_device)

I don't know if this was a happy accident of a set designer just using what he thought was a high tech modern weapon, or another example of the less than subtle sarcastic social commentary in the movie. But either way seeing those running around is a trip.