DS9 - Hard Time

[MerelyAFan]

https://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/d491.php

I will say that as much as this is a genuinely gripping character piece with O'Brien, it does feel unfortunate that its essentially resolved by the end and never brought up again. TNG certainly could be guilty of putting the characters through genuine trauma only for them to be fine the next week, but even they referenced episodes like the Inner Light later and Picard's assault by the Borg remains a significant wound throughout the rest of the series and First Contact.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Actually, Picard went through the same thing sans the torture, and they bring it up near the end of season 6 when he talks about his flute and how significant it is because of that experience.


O'Brien is pretty much the John McClane of the Star Trek universe, so him going through this without much post trauma seems passable.

[Fianna]

This is really the sort of story that would be better served on an anthology series, not one where you have to see the character again, week after week.

O'Brien is now, mentally, twenty years older than he was before. When you add in how extreme his experience of those twenty years was, the O'Brien we see from this point onward should be a radically different person from the one we've seen before. But, of course, that's not what happens.

[clearspira]

Reset button at its finest.

Rewatching Babylon 5 recently and the difference is night and day: DS9 is Babylon 5 lite. An inferior copy. Mona Lisa with a moustache.

Look at Franklin's drug problem, Garibaldi's brainwashing, G'kar's eye, Londo's dodgy deals. Things happen and they matter in B5. Here, we have a mind raped man, someone who is mentally 20 years older than he should be. A man who frightens his kids.
And it does not matter. Not one damn bit. O'Brien next week is the same man as O'Brien the week before. A real lost opportunity.

[Akkristor]

Video is coming up as "Content Rejected. This video has been removed due to a breach of the Terms of Use." for me.

Edit: Video is back up. Weird.

[J!!]

I thought it'd be interesting to compare this episode with Voyager's The Chute, since they demonstrate the two shows differing approaches to what is effectively the exact same premise: a main character trapped in an alien prison, and losing their humanity as a consequence of the experience. Both episodes also had the same writing challenge: said character can't actually spend the months or years in prison that it would take for that to happen. Both shows solved this problem with treknobabble, but as with everything else, they did so completely differently.

[clearspira]

I thought it'd be interesting to compare this episode with Voyager's The Chute, since they demonstrate the two shows differing approaches to what is effectively the exact same premise: a main character trapped in an alien prison, and losing their humanity as a consequence of the experience. Both episodes also had the same writing challenge: said character can't actually spend the months or years in prison that it would take for that to happen. Both shows solved this problem with treknobabble, but as with everything else, they did so completely differently.

Ultimately I think neither was better because they both ended up being meaningless with zero impact on their leads. Different methods, same outcome.

I like O'Brien more than Kim and Paris so DS9 wins only on that point.

[Rocketboy1313]

I agree that this is the sort of story that would work better in an anthology ("Black Mirror" as Chuck mentioned) story... Or if it was somehow tied into an ongoing narrative.

That being said, they could have handwaved it away by saying that the alien's process on O'Brien did not continue to hold such a strong grip on him. That the memories faded faster over time than is typical for memories. That while they remain clear, they feel more like an especially profound dream rather than actual events.

Is an explanation needed? Eh... I kind of just accept this as a feature of 90's television that stuff happens and then fades into the background. It is a product of its time.

"Babylon 5" was much better at this, but to say that DS9 is an inferior copy is disingenuous, DS9 has (on the whole) better acting and production value which elevates it, even if this sort of non-serialized story stands out as a weakness to its greater narrative.
If DS9 were made today, stories like this one would exist and would have greater impact on the continuity of the character. Then again if B5 were made toady it would not suffer from its production shortfalls.

I agree with Chuck that the episode is hard to watch. It borders on mean spirited, and perhaps that is why the whole, "it should have had a more lasting impact" resonates. That if you are going to make an episode that dark it should have more of a lasting impact and shouldn't lift out.

[DanteC]

Having not watched the episode in question and viewing the review, two questions.
a) Couldn't they get a telepath to put in memory blocks or such? The idea probably came from watching too much Babylon 5, but a vulcan would surely know a few tricks?
b) Another case of technology having other implications, but a device that essentially puts you into a mental prison with conversable characters obviously is used here as a prison, but what if the character in question was a teacher? Imagine being taught subjects in this manner essentially while you sleep? (I think something similar happens in the third Altered Carbon book). It'd make that pesky Starfleet exam a lot easier to prep for.

[clearspira]

Having not watched the episode in question and viewing the review, two questions.
a) Couldn't they get a telepath to put in memory blocks or such? The idea probably came from watching too much Babylon 5, but a vulcan would surely know a few tricks?

Trek has always had a weird (badly thought out?) approach to telepaths. Women like Troi and Lwaxana can read you when they like and how deeply they like without obstacle, prevention, and seemingly without any worry from the law. It has also been stated that no telepathic defences exist short of burning out someone's brain. And yet when it comes to them being used for anything practical or useful such as with O'Brien, it always seems to be limited to the odd mind meld or Troi ''shaking like a puppy and crying'' moment as she reads you.

I am not going to sit here and say that I am on the side of Bester and the Psi Corps - but there is a middle ground. Credit card numbers, top secret information, nuclear launch codes, damning secrets that would ruin you if they got out. Lwaxana should not be able to just steal these things from your brain whenever she likes without penalty.