Acolyte fix it.

[Thebestoftherest]

Not bad but it feels too much like you just painting the jedi as cowboy with white hat, when this show was suppose to challenge that preception.

[CharlesPhipps]

Not bad but it feels too much like you just painting the jedi as cowboy with white hat, when this show was suppose to challenge that preception.

The Jedi have been shit upon for the past thirty years. Anyone who feels they need to "deconstruct" the Jedi anymore is clearly someone who never needs to write again. Maybe, just maybe the paladin equivalents should be allowed to be heroes.

[TGLS]

I think it has to do with the rise of serialization in television media. Nobody talks about The Simpsons in this way (well, unless they just want the show to end, but that's different). Many serialized shows have season long plots that create structural problems that can't be fixed with out tearing the whole thing apart.

See I think people did absolutely talk about The Simpsons that way. That show got so much internet criticism during what we now call the classic years or golden age, and that was how we got the Poochie episode so the writers could slap back and call their fans ungrateful and entitled. There was also apparently an online schism caused by Marge vs the Monorail in regard to where the show went from a subversive sitcom to something far more wackier.

Yeah, but that misses the point. I was referring to how people are talking about The Simpsons now, and the discourse isn't focusing on "How to Fix Season 34". At the same time, I get that people at the time were frustrated with the change in the direction of the show, but the topic of the discourse wouldn't be, "Let's take the concept of Season 5 and redo it", it would be (maybe) "How could we do an episode where Homer goes to College better?" or "This new direction they're taking the show is too wacky!" "Fixing" a season of an episodic show just doesn't work.

[hammerofglass]

Not bad but it feels too much like you just painting the jedi as cowboy with white hat, when this show was suppose to challenge that preception.

The Jedi have been shit upon for the past thirty years. Anyone who feels they need to "deconstruct" the Jedi anymore is clearly someone who never needs to write again. Maybe, just maybe the paladin equivalents should be allowed to be heroes.

Even in the OT it was really just Luke who was a Paladin. Yoda and Kenobi both told him trying to redeem Vader was a waste of time so just kill him.

[CharlesPhipps]

Even in the OT it was really just Luke who was a Paladin. Yoda and Kenobi both told him trying to redeem Vader was a waste of time so just kill him.

True but I suppose I see more value in, "The Jedi actually being heroes doing heroic things--but people with real flaws and struggles" as more interesting than "Here's how they're failures." Oddly, I think George did that really well in the Clone Wars cartoons.

We want the Jedi failing to be viewed as a TRAGEDY not a inevitability or, worse, a good thing.

[Madner Kami]

Not bad but it feels too much like you just painting the jedi as cowboy with white hat, when this show was suppose to challenge that preception.

The Jedi have been shit upon for the past thirty years. Anyone who feels they need to "deconstruct" the Jedi anymore is clearly someone who never needs to write again. Maybe, just maybe the paladin equivalents should be allowed to be heroes.

Even in the OT it was really just Luke who was a Paladin. Yoda and Kenobi both told him trying to redeem Vader was a waste of time so just kill him.

Also, there's the Zeitgeist. We live in post-modern times and an integral part of that period is, Deconstruction. I've got no doubt that in 10, 20 years, the Deconstruction will be deconstructed and the Paladin-Jedi will be reconstructed. Just gotta bide your time.

Hm, come to think of it... Isn't every period marked by the Deconstruction of what preceeds it, so it's essentially an endless cycle of Deconstruction and Deconstruction of Deconstruction aka Reconstruction?

[hammerofglass]

Not bad but it feels too much like you just painting the jedi as cowboy with white hat, when this show was suppose to challenge that preception.

The Jedi have been shit upon for the past thirty years. Anyone who feels they need to "deconstruct" the Jedi anymore is clearly someone who never needs to write again. Maybe, just maybe the paladin equivalents should be allowed to be heroes.

Even in the OT it was really just Luke who was a Paladin. Yoda and Kenobi both told him trying to redeem Vader was a waste of time so just kill him.

Also, there's the Zeitgeist. We live in post-modern times and an integral part of that period is, Deconstruction. I've got no doubt that in 10, 20 years, the Deconstruction will be deconstructed and the Paladin-Jedi will be reconstructed. Just gotta bide your time.

Hm, come to think of it... Isn't every period marked by the Deconstruction of what preceeds it, so it's essentially an endless cycle of Deconstruction and Deconstruction of Deconstruction aka Reconstruction?

We're seeing it with Superman right now and it's awesome.

If they were going to the movies coming up about Rey's new Jedi order would be a great time.

[McAvoy]

I remember we kinda accepted each season as is, and then critiqued it as a whole. But I never saw anyone wanting a whole season redo. Maybe Season 7 due to the whole thing with Ezri and Jadzia Dax, but even then Ezri Dax was beloved by the fandom due to how cute she was and interesting episodes. But I don't recall a mass fan outrage to do a redo of Season 7 but with Jadzia.

I originally wrote a really long post here, but the forum ate it. so I'll just give the Reader's Digest version, which is that at the time, there were a lot of people wishing the war had ended earlier, so that we could have had an epilogue focused on the aftermath—particularly, we could 1) see what happened to Cardassia after all the destruction, and 2) whether Bajor ever joined the Federation (you know, the original premise of the whole show). As a side benefit of doing this, they could have cut down on a lot of the incessant filler that Seasons 6 and 7 were plagued with.

I think just about everybody also wished they'd chosen something different to do with Dukat as well (or just written him out of the show post-Sacrifice of Angels).

Personally, I would have liked to either lose or dramatically change a bunch of things: the pagh wraiths, the less interesting new direction for the Prophets, Section 31, Vic, all that damn filler, etc.

I remember there was some talk about that. Ending the war a few episodes to see the aftermath and maybe create a more complete ending for Sisko versus Dukat or Kira versus Dukat or combination of both. That and the dislike of having Dukat the fake Bajoran removed. I do remember that.

Combine that with having Jadzia instead of Ezri so we would have less episodes establishibg her as well.

But I just remember a wide spread fan outcry to redo the final season. We all accepted it and just wished it could have been different.

[Durandal_1707]

I would have scrapped the possessed-Dukat plotline altogether. Leave him in Federation custody (that escape was extremely contrived anyway). After the war is over, let him see the devastation that his actions caused to his home. It's really the logical ending for a character like that.

[McAvoy]

I would have scrapped the possessed-Dukat plotline altogether. Leave him in Federation custody (that escape was extremely contrived anyway). After the war is over, let him see the devastation that his actions caused to his home. It's really the logical ending for a character like that.

I don't know. I can easily see Dukat as the antithesis of Sisko or Kira. Dukat being a bookend for either for the series honestly. So to me it makes sense for Dukat being the Final Boss for either for the finale of the series.

Would make it interesting if both Kira and Sisko was there for the final fight between the Prophets and Pah Wraiths and Bajoran soul. Sisko versus Dukat. Sisko versus Kai Winn. Kira versus Dukat. Kira versus Kai Winn.

I just don't see it as how DS9 laid it out for the Female Founder to be the Final Boss for the series.