stryke wrote: ↑Sun Dec 01, 2024 11:39 am
Given some of the 'lol gay' jokes they were making with Bashir and OBrien I think it's for the best they didn't go that route.
Rumour has it that Garak was meant to be gay but they could not get away with it. Ziyal was meant to be his beard until someone pointed out how creepy it looked. This could be true but I do think there are alternative theories however.
My headcanon is that Garak is Garak. He is lies layered on lies layered on lies. He is whatever gender or sexuality that he needs to be on any given day. He latched onto Bashir not because he is secretly homosexual but because Bashir is someone in a position of power whom Garak thought could be easily manipulated - the friendship came later. If Julian was Julianne then he would have acted in exactly the same way.
Given how family orientated Cardassians are, I think that his lack of relationships can be attributed again not to being closeted but to being cast out by his father. Being brought up to believe in family and then being cast out like trash would put a dampener on anyone's belief in that particular tradition.
I'm down with Garak being bi so I agree. Also everyone should read Stitch in Time by Andrew J Robinson which is easily the best Trek book ever, and while it's been ages since I read it, I think it also confirms him being bi.
The Ziyal stuff was just gross, and I hated it. I believe Andrew said he played Garak as poly, which I can see. I think he did find Bashir attractive, but acted it up to mess with him.
Science Fiction is a genre where anything can happen. Just make sure what happens is enjoyable for yourself and your audience.
Nobody700 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 5:48 pm
The Ziyal stuff was just gross, and I hated it. I believe Andrew said he played Garak as poly, which I can see. I think he did find Bashir attractive, but acted it up to mess with him.
Yeah the Ziyal arc was just off. I think it could have been played better as two outcasts from Cardassia just having a connection. Ziyal was played like she had a crush on Garak and also played a bit like she was an adult when she wasn't.
Nobody700 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 5:48 pm
The Ziyal stuff was just gross, and I hated it. I believe Andrew said he played Garak as poly, which I can see. I think he did find Bashir attractive, but acted it up to mess with him.
Yeah the Ziyal arc was just off. I think it could have been played better as two outcasts from Cardassia just having a connection. Ziyal was played like she had a crush on Garak and also played a bit like she was an adult when she wasn't.
Yeah, that was the weird thing about this character. The "first" Ziyal was the only one who really looked and acted like she was meant to. The "third" Ziyal was a full blown woman in looks and personality.
It also kind of speaks to the era the show was made in that an Ellie and Joel relationship was considered by them to be creepy. They could teach each other much. It did not have to have any romantic overtones at all.
Nobody700 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 5:48 pm
The Ziyal stuff was just gross, and I hated it. I believe Andrew said he played Garak as poly, which I can see. I think he did find Bashir attractive, but acted it up to mess with him.
Yeah the Ziyal arc was just off. I think it could have been played better as two outcasts from Cardassia just having a connection. Ziyal was played like she had a crush on Garak and also played a bit like she was an adult when she wasn't.
Yeah, that was the weird thing about this character. The "first" Ziyal was the only one who really looked and acted like she was meant to. The "third" Ziyal was a full blown woman in looks and personality.
It also kind of speaks to the era the show was made in that an Ellie and Joel relationship was considered by them to be creepy. They could teach each other much. It did not have to have any romantic overtones at all.
I think it was wrong even then at that time. A middle aged man and basically a teenager but wait! It's OK because now we brought in an older actress so it's OK.
No it should have been exactly what it was. Two Cardassians through their own stories unable to go home. Ziyal due to her father and being half Bajoran and Garak being a disgraced 007.
