Should we defund ICE?

[TGLS]

Minarchism is not that complicated, and if not complete defunding then at least a heavy slash to all budgets. Bureaucracy is the fourth branch of the US government that the founders never intended to create and, there for, has no form of check or balance. It just grows without end.

If the founders didn't intend to create a bureaucracy, they did a remarkably bad job preventing it, allowing the legislature to create it and all. Oh, yeah, it does have a check. The legislature can just unmake it.

[Darth Wedgius]

Again, let me remind you that ICE is employing options 2 and 3 simultaneously.

Crimes can be prosecuted through the court system. There is no reason why we need a shady rogue agency with far-reaching extrajudicial powers JUST to snatch up spanish-speaking people who crossed a line in the sand.

It is difficult to employ options 2 and 3 simultaneously, at least for the same individuals. The many worlds hypothesis aside, of course.

If you believe that national borders should not be enforced ("line in the sand") and is happening simply because people want to pick on one of the Romance languages, of course you will want ICE to be eliminated.

[unknownsample]

I cannot believe that people are defending this inhumanity.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... -many-kids

The Trump administration’s separation of families at the border — taking children from their parents, arresting the parents, and taking the kids into custody — sounds almost too cruel to be real. But the separations are, in fact, real, and new data reported by the Associated Press shows just how many children have been separated from their parents.

The AP acquired internal Department of Homeland Security data on the program, covering the period of April 19 to May 31. Over that time span, 1,995 children were taken from their migrant parents at the border. That’s an average of roughly 48 kids separated from their families per day, often sent into foster homes or held in detention centers.

This might actually be an undercount. On a call with reporters Friday, DHS officials said this number reflects only the families that have been separated when parents were sent into criminal custody to be prosecuted for illegal entry. Some families presented themselves for asylum legally by coming to a port of entry — an official border crossing — and were then separated; they weren’t included in the AP figures.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Did you hear about the immigrant man in my city that got snatched up by ICE in the courthouse where he was finalizing his green card process?

The only difference between ICE and existing enforcement measures is the extreme cruelty and the lack of accountability.

[Darth Wedgius]

Did you hear about the immigrant man in my city that got snatched up by ICE in the courthouse where he was finalizing his green card process?

I did, and it seemed harsh, and then I looked into it. He entered the U.S. illegally, was deported, and entered the U.S. illegally again, didn't he?

The only difference between ICE and existing enforcement measures is the extreme cruelty and the lack of accountability.

I'm not sure what you mean by "existing enforcement measures" as ICE is an existing enforcement measure, and enforcement measure might mean all laws or just immigration laws in this context. And, again, other legal processes routinely separate family members.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Let me put it a different way then. Existing enforcement agencies. We have lots of groups to deal with breaking of the law. Why do we need a special organization with such wide-reaching powers for immigration? What makes this so special, and why support such a cruel organization?

https://twitter.com/MikeOLoughlin/statu ... -border%2F

[Antiboyscout]

This argument appears to be very late. About 4 years late.

[Deledrius]

This argument appears to be very late. About 4 years late.

Better late than never?

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Yes, this has been going on before. This kind of gremplork has been going on since Bush founded ICE.

I'm complaining about it now, I want to do something now, and the underlying injustice has been brought to the attention of many people by the fresh wave of atrocities, and by things getting even worse than they were before.

[Darth Wedgius]

Let me put it a different way then. Existing enforcement agencies. We have lots of groups to deal with breaking of the law. Why do we need a special organization with such wide-reaching powers for immigration? What makes this so special, and why support such a cruel organization?

https://twitter.com/MikeOLoughlin/statu ... -border%2F

Well, this is a specific area of the law, and it seems more efficient to have a force of people trained in one area than rely on general law enforcement. And as far as why supporting such a cruel organization, that would be to have border enforcement.