Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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ChiggyvonRichthofen wrote:the Jedi must end because their dogma has led to too many rejecting the Light Side. Jedi dogma led to Anakin hiding things from the Council, which led to disaster, and obviously Luke's pupils didn't meet the best end either.
Having watched 'The Clone Wars' and 'Rebels', plus being aware of a few rumors I think this is the more likely answer.

Anyways...behind the scenes photos:

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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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Why are they black and white?
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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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Rian Johnson, the films director, took the photos on his personal camera.
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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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Some more BTS photos

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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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Hope everyone had a great Easter.

Just catching up on this a little. The response to the pretty subdued. I'd nail it down to an inverse of the nostalgia effect that TFA's trailer brought.

The crowning moment of TFA's trailer was Han and Chewie appearing, and saying "We're home." which tugged at the heartstrings of the old trilogy fans.

TLJ's "It's time for the Jedi to end" has had the opposite effect. Even the cheering fans at the unveiling had a weird response to it.

Luke's gone from "Return of the Jedi" to "The Last Jedi" with a history of failure inbetween. It's hardly inspiring.
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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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It is depressing, yes, though I reserve final judgement until we know more about what Luke's motives are, and how it ultimately plays out.

I don't think it diminishes what he accomplished in RotJ. But it is sad to see Luke, to all appearances, a defeated old man. And doubly sad to think that we will never see Luke, Leia, and Han reunited on-screen. :(

Edit: I mean, seriously? All the fan service they crammed into TFA, and they couldn't give us that?
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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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The Romulan Republic wrote:It is depressing, yes, though I reserve final judgement until we know more about what Luke's motives are, and how it ultimately plays out.

I don't think it diminishes what he accomplished in RotJ. But it is sad to see Luke, to all appearances, a defeated old man. And doubly sad to think that we will never see Luke, Leia, and Han reunited on-screen. :(

Edit: I mean, seriously? All the fan service they crammed into TFA, and they couldn't give us that?
Definitely agreed on the trio never meeting up again. I do think this adds a serious downer to the end of the original trilogy though. Han and Leia broke up, their kid is a psychopath, Luke failed and lives as a hermit.

Current theory is that they're going with a Knights of Zakuul or a "Visions in the Dark" approach to how the force is handled.
http://www.xamxamsays.com/review-chapte ... -the-dark/

They've been hinting at other approaches to the force in Rebels as well.

What concerns me is that that they're making the Jedi order a bit like the fan screeds on how they were a broken and corrupt organisation rather than the benevolent but flawed one they were. You don't get to be the guardians of a galaxy spanning Republic for a thousand generations without doing something right.

The Jedi Order had become arrogant and dispassionate after they had remained untested by the Sith for centuries but they were due for a reformation under Luke's new order. Instead they're apparently being disbanded for some new and improved grey order. It reminds me of so much badly written fanfiction from the forums of yore.
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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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They specifically kept Luke out of TFA because he tended to dominate over the new characters in the initial drafts...which is not what they wanted. Furthermore Han originally survived and reunited with Leia....but JJ Abrams came to the conclusion (and I'm pretty sure Ford agreed) that it worked better to have him die at Kylo Ren's hands, cementing him as the villain. (The only way Kylo Ren would have a chance to get anywhere near a villain like Vader was to kill such a beloved character). The above are some of the reasons I never agree with the premise of this thread...cause if they were risk Averse, they would've had the big three come together and just made all our new characters their kids.

A willingness to take risk also acknowledges that those risk might not work out. Rian's script has been described as weird, dark etc so they know they are taking a chance, but they are betting on Rian's skills plus that of the caste and crew around him to pull it off.


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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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Ordo wrote:They specifically kept Luke out of TFA because he tended to dominate over the new characters in the initial drafts...which is not what they wanted. Furthermore Han originally survived and reunited with Leia....but JJ Abrams came to the conclusion (and I'm pretty sure Ford agreed) that it worked better to have him die at Kylo Ren's hands, cementing him as the villain. (The only way Kylo Ren would have a chance to get anywhere near a villain like Vader was to kill such a beloved character). The above are some of the reasons I never agree with the premise of this thread...cause if they were risk Averse, they would've had the big three come together and just made all our new characters their kids.

A willingness to take risk also acknowledges that those risk might not work out. Rian's script has been described as weird, dark etc so they know they are taking a chance, but they are betting on Rian's skills plus that of the caste and crew around him to pull it off.
Unfortunately they kept Luke out because he "overshadowed" Rey. Unfortunately I think this is a continuation of the poor fan-fic level writing that pervaded TFA. They didn't want anyone to appear stronger than their new merchandisable and not yet licenced to every toy company character.

This bizarre leap of logic suggests that Obi Wan and Yoda overshadowed Luke and should have been written out. Or that Gandalf overshadowed Frodo in Lord of the Rings and should have been written out.

Knowing that there was basically a mandate to write Rey in such a way to sell merchandise and find more ways for Disney to exploit the young girl market by diversifying their character range with the current girl power fad, how much of the final script is some sort executive interference or just plain bad writing is difficult to gauge.

The latter is more likely though, original concepts had the opening shot being Luke's hand floating through space holding his old saber without thinking how it could have gotten there, and Maz using the force without consideration for anyone in the last 50 years doing anything about the force sensitive innkeeper.

When it comes to TFA being safe though, I definitely say it was. Everything from the basic plot to the aesthetics of the First Order and Resistance which were re-branded and palette swapped Galactic Empire and Rebellion.

It doesn't make much sense with TIE Fighters for example, from a Lore perspective the giant hexagon wings were only used on the cheap, mass produced models and swapped for low profile bent wing designs on every following design. The advanced TIE/fo keep the giant wings pretty much for evoking nostalgia in original trilogy fans.

Unfortunately while I do applaud them taking risks and going somewhere with Rian's script I get the feeling that we might be walking into another midichlorians scenario on a grander scale. Something new inserted into the universe not really understanding the spirit and mythology that's built up around the work and damages the lore as a result.
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Re: Does it bother you that Disney will be risk averse with Star Wars?

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Fixer wrote: Unfortunately they kept Luke out because he "overshadowed" Rey. Unfortunately I think this is a continuation of the poor fan-fic level writing that pervaded TFA. They didn't want anyone to appear stronger than their new merchandisable and not yet licenced to every toy company character.
Again I have to disagree

From the writer:
“Early on I tried to write versions of the story where [Rey] is at home, her home is destroyed, and then she goes on the road and meets Luke. And then she goes and kicks the bad guy’s ass,” Arndt said (via EW). “It just never worked and I struggled with this. This was back in 2012.” Apparently the issue was Luke’s presence was always upstaging everyone in the script. “It just felt like every time Luke came in and entered the movie, he just took it over,” Arndt continued. “Suddenly you didn’t care about your main character anymore because, ‘Oh f–k, Luke Skywalker’s here. I want to see what he’s going to do.’”
I honestly don't think this was about merchandising...I think Luke took over the film as he says.
This bizarre leap of logic suggests that Obi Wan and Yoda overshadowed Luke and should have been written out.
I don't think the scenario you mention is comparable to the one in TFA. Luke has three movies plus years of EU material behind him at this point. Kenobi and Yoda had nowhere near the fan following/investment that Luke has now, when they were instructing the young Skywalker. The fact people were clamoring to know where Luke was in all the trailers to TFA tells me the writers were right...if Luke had shown up earlier in the film he would've taken it over and just about tossed the new characters aside...unintentionally.
Knowing that there was basically a mandate to write Rey in such a way to sell merchandise
They wanted a strong female force users for young girls to look up to...but I wouldn't say they were specifically trying to sell toys...since all the quotes I've seen on the subject suggest they didn't design anyone to just sell toys.
When it comes to TFA being safe though, I definitely say it was. Everything from the basic plot to the aesthetics of the First Order and Resistance which were re-branded and palette swapped Galactic Empire and Rebellion.
It had familiar elements but the chances it took were noticeable. The safest thing to do would've been to have Luke, Leia, and Han all feature prominently in the film and come together again. Instead Han is killed by his own son, Luke is kept out until the very end and given no speaking lines while Rey and Finn are focused and built up in hopes audiences will take a liking to them
It doesn't make much sense with TIE Fighters for example, from a Lore perspective the giant hexagon wings were only used on the cheap, mass produced models and swapped for low profile bent wing designs on every following design. The advanced TIE/fo keep the giant wings pretty much for evoking nostalgia in original trilogy fans.
They did use nostalgia, but I don't think the design of a TIE fighter overshadows the risk already taken on screen.
Unfortunately while I do applaud them taking risks and going somewhere with Rian's script I get the feeling that we might be walking into another midichlorians scenario on a grander scale. Something new inserted into the universe not really understanding the spirit and mythology that's built up around the work and damages the lore as a result.
Look....if you've watched the Clone wars series then you are aware of the 'Mortiss' episodes and the final episode where Yoda went on a trip to explore the nature of the force. Both of these episodes had heavy involvement from George Lucas, so if TLJ is using that to continue forward then, to me, it's not an insertion of something new...it's a further revelation upon a world we don't fully understand. The story group has a vested interest in keeping everything straight, so I figure it will all line up (more or less) as we continue on.
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