I admit, this makes me queasy...

[LittleRaven]

17 year old legally self-euthanizes.

A 17-year-old Dutch girl was legally allowed to kill herself using euthanasia after she was raped when younger and spent years battling depression, according to a report Tuesday.

“Love is letting go, in this case,” Noa Pothoven of Arnhem wrote in an Instagram post announcing her choice to die in the living room of her home Sunday.

Pothoven — who was sexually abused at 11 and raped three years later — said she was sick of suffering “unbearable pain.

“Maybe this comes as a surprise to some, given my posts about hospitalization, but my plan has been there for a long time and is not impulsive,” she wrote.

“I will get straight to the point: within a maximum of 10 days I will die,” she added. “After years of battling and fighting, I am drained. I have quit eating and drinking for a while now, and after many discussions and evaluations, it was decided to let me go because my suffering is unbearable.

”I breathe, but I no longer live.”

I honestly don't know what to make of this. On the one hand, I'm generally in favor of individual liberty - including the right of people to self-terminate. On the other hand, seeing a 17 year old do this crushes me. And yes, I realize that teenagers kill themselves all the time. It's a difficult time of life. But there's still a difference when it's state-sanctioned.

Ick. Ick ick ick ick ick.

[Mecha82]

That is really sad and depressing news. I can't image what she did went trough to want to end her own life and to point that it was state-sanctioned. I do wonder did she get any help before that and if she did how useless that might had been. And at that young age. This world can be so twisted that terrible things like these can happen even in modern western world.

[ProfessorDetective]

At least she won't be hurting anymore. But damn...

And yeah, you have the right to do with your life as you please, even to end it on your own terms. It's a damn shame it had to come to that for her, but... Yeah...

[Madner Kami]

Call me heartless, but I'm having issues with this. Her parents don't know about what happened to her at the ages of 11, 14 and possibly 12 and only learn of her predicament at the age of 16, when she finally gets treatment and then, one year later, she's being given up legally and gets assisted suicide. Oh and somewhere along that line she manages to write a best-selling autobiography. Now there is more things going wrong here than "only" the sexual assaults and alleged rapes and I can't quite figure out whether it's terrible journalism (everyone publishing the exact same Reuters newsflash with only minor changes) or if this case is really wierdly convoluted and a prime example of how not to deal with people suffering her conditions.

[LittleRaven]

And yeah, you have the right to do with your life as you please, even to end it on your own terms. It's a damn shame it had to come to that for her, but... Yeah...

But...does an individual always have a right to self-terminate? Do you really think that? Do we, as a society, really think that?

I'm thinking of Fuzzy's thread from a couple of weeks ago about how ICE is keeping a lot of refugees in solitary confinement. If you actually do research on WHY ICE is holding so many people in solitary, (instead of relying on crappy Buzzfeed sensationalism) you'll find that a lot of it is because people being held in detention centers express suicidal tendencies with disturbing regularity, and one of the only methods our current system has for dealing with that is to put a person in solitary where they can be put on suicide watch. That's obviously not ideal for a lot of reasons, but the point is, our system goes to some lengths to make sure people DO NOT kill themselves when in government custody.

But if we carry your statement to it's logical extremes, we really shouldn't be doing that, right? Instead, when a vulnerable person is brought to the attention of the authorities, we should simply hand them a syringe with a lethal dose of morphine and wish them well. Bam. Two problems solved right off the bat. They get their individual liberty and we have one less detainee to deal with.

But I'm pretty sure you would consider that to be monstrous. I would, anyway. So obviously my belief in self-termination has limits. I suspect that's true for most people.

Hmm.

(In case it isn't obvious, I'm using your statement as a jumping off point for a bit of self-reflection, not accusing you of anything. )

[Zoinksberg]

Has she seen the Saw movies? I feel like she should first.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

But if we carry your statement to it's logical extremes, we really shouldn't be doing that, right? Instead, when a vulnerable person is brought to the attention of the authorities, we should simply hand them a syringe with a lethal dose of morphine and wish them well. Bam. Two problems solved right off the bat. They get their individual liberty and we have one less detainee to deal with.

I don't see it so much as a matter of what we do as a society (public, government, medical/psychology establishment), just a matter of asking what can you really do at a certain fundamental level. I don't necessarily have problems with how personal infliction is treated, and how morbid thoughts are treated as a mental illness, at least on the basis that a mental illness isn't of the most concrete measures.

Though the complication as I see it is that it feels like we just bridge the gap on our own terms and presume a bit that there's definitely something not working properly (psychological circumstance or maybe physically). Again, I think it's a very rational measure, just not one that necessarily mandates we relinquish someone's agency so to speak. Not like, politically sound, what not.

Still though, the state actually sanctioning this (in accordance or opposition to the other establishments I listed?) is pretty weird.

[Madner Kami]

But if we carry your statement to it's logical extremes, we really shouldn't be doing that, right? Instead, when a vulnerable person is brought to the attention of the authorities, we should simply hand them a syringe with a lethal dose of morphine and wish them well. Bam. Two problems solved right off the bat. They get their individual liberty and we have one less detainee to deal with.

In general, I am fine with suicide and assisted suicide in cases where people just can not lead a life they deem worth living. But, and that is the important part, assisted suicide needs to be strongly regulated and monitored and all other options should have been explored before.
In this particular case, patients must be at least 17 years old (not quite sure why, because you legally are an adult at the age of 18 there), two doctors must have signed off and an ethics commission or commissioner must have investigated and agreed to the conclusion that, "the patient's suffering is unbearable with no prospect of improvement" (according to the law). Technically, children between 12 and 17 can recieve assisted suicide, but only if their parents agreed to it. Rules like these seem sensible at first glance and in regards to unassisted suicide... well... there's not much you can anyways, unless they do not succeed, in which case they did not techncially commit suicide, which makes prosecution kinda pointless, due to literally lacking a murder-victim, given the victim is provably alive.

As for the case in question, I don't know too many details, but the time-frame just feels off. I don't feel as if enough was tried before writing her off like that and find, that this just should not have been the agreed-upon course of action.

[Nealithi]

So according to the article she went to a hospital so under weight she was suffering organ failure. But the parents had no idea anything was wrong? Then the insisted she get medical treatment that included Electroshock therapy to make her happy again? Why does this feel like the parents are part of the problem here?

As to the assisted suicide. . Yes? I think making it legal might lower unassisted suicide and maybe just maybe uncover causes? But I have hopes that may be very unrealistic.

[Mecha82]

So according to the article she went to a hospital so under weight she was suffering organ failure. But the parents had no idea anything was wrong? Then the insisted she get medical treatment that included Electroshock therapy to make her happy again? Why does this feel like the parents are part of the problem here?

It does really seem like her parents were part of the problem and failures as parents. How oblivious they were if they didn't realize that she was suffering mentally and that they thought that some how Electroshock therapy would had been solution.