Star Trek: Lower Decks

[chaos42]

i think you might be in the wrong topic this is star trek not star wars, the problem is that if a character doesn't have flaws to overcome its not as good a story and the character is flat.

[McAvoy]

Season 2 wasn't that bad. Season 1 had so much going on it was sometimes hard to keep track of what is going on.

Indeed, there was a lot of good ideas going on like the Spore Drive, but other elements weren't given enough attention like the relationship between Stamets and Dr. Hugh, and because of this Season 1 felt like it was all over the place.

Season 2 had distinctive episodes. That's how you have to structure these streaming series with extended movie plotlines. Season 1 mostly felt like a big plot for like 3-4 episodes at a time.

Indeed, while I do like serialized story, Seasons 1 and 2 of Star Trek Discovery was weird in how the series story was structured, personally I think Seasons 1-4 of New Doctor Who did a great job of how they structured their stories, with each episode being a stand alone with elements in the background that are apart of a series long arc that gets paid off in the finally.

And while I really liked the serialized story of Star Trek Picard which was handled a lot better than Star Trek Discovery, I think we can do with an episodic series, which I believe Star Trek Lower Decks is going to be.

Exactly. Discovery writers and producers should follow that example. Maybe make it less like how Michael is the center of the universe too.

Also, since they are in the future in season 3 don't make it depressing either that only the Discovery can solve. Maybe use of the Spore Drive can happen but with added future tech.

I am hoping they are not making thd future some dreadful place that no one wants.

Ok, this is going to be the most controversial thing I'm going to say, I really like Michael Burnham, I like that she's the adopted sister to Spock, she has a very interesting backstory, and Sonequa Martin-Green is a fantastic actress, however I do agree that she carries far to much of the story in Star Trek Discovery, so with a lot of her stories being resolved last season it will good for her to not take center stage all the time next season.

Actually I think outside her being Spock's adopted sister and her being the center of the stories too much I think people will admit she is actually a good character.

Maybe they could have made her not adopted by Sarek but a mentor, teacher to her. A slight twist but it would help with continuity.

I just don't like the Spore Drive at all. Nothing about it. Especially how it makes the saucer spin

[chaos42]

she isn't a bad character but she does drift into mary sue territory, the spock's adopted sister thing, i could take or leave but being sarek's student that would have been a lot better. like her parents were killed and sarek was more a guardian and helped her and made sure she was schooled, he doesn't have to adopt her.

also the spore drive is an entire different problem not to mention the possibility that the concept was ripped off from that guys video game. but the spinning saucer is something i just don't pay attention to because its stupid, plus i just don't like the design, some new from of drive is fine but they should put some more limitations into it like it only works within this area of space it doesn't extend beyond this area -this way it doesn't give us the why didn't they pull it out to go save voyager or other stuff like that.

but back to lower decks, i would like to see the crew dealing with some more mundane stuff that is cause by bureaucratic stupidity. Like id like to see them get given the run around trying to fix or deal with something because there is some really convoluted system in place for what they need that just feeds back into itself. like the old you can't get this without a permit and when they go im sorry you can't get a permit without already having the item to register for the permit.

That kind of humor makes me laugh kinda a cross between dilbert and star trek

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

she isn't a bad character but she does drift into mary sue territory, the spock's adopted sister thing, i could take or leave but being sarek's student that would have been a lot better. like her parents were killed and sarek was more a guardian and helped her and made sure she was schooled, he doesn't have to adopt her.

How does her being his daughter render her a mary sue?

also the spore drive is an entire different problem not to mention the possibility that the concept was ripped off from that guys video game. but the spinning saucer is something i just don't pay attention to because its stupid, plus i just don't like the design, some new from of drive is fine but they should put some more limitations into it like it only works within this area of space it doesn't extend beyond this area -this way it doesn't give us the why didn't they pull it out to go save voyager or other stuff like that.

It's a little convenient to just shove this 2-season arc of hyper travel that has to never be brought up again. That's pretty much all I care about it though, it just comes off a bit too obvious in overall concept.

On its own though I liked everything that happened surrounding it.

but back to lower decks, i would like to see the crew dealing with some more mundane stuff that is cause by bureaucratic stupidity. Like id like to see them get given the run around trying to fix or deal with something because there is some really convoluted system in place for what they need that just feeds back into itself. like the old you can't get this without a permit and when they go im sorry you can't get a permit without already having the item to register for the permit.

That kind of humor makes me laugh kinda a cross between dilbert and star trek

Sounds a bit over the head of an animated series kinda. I wouldn't say they're made for kids, but a lot of these types of shows are a little more worn on the sleeve.

[Link8909]

she isn't a bad character but she does drift into mary sue territory, the spock's adopted sister thing, i could take or leave but being sarek's student that would have been a lot better. like her parents were killed and sarek was more a guardian and helped her and made sure she was schooled, he doesn't have to adopt her.

How does her being his daughter render her a mary sue?

Yeah, I've never got that myself, honestly I think using mary sue as a means to critic a piece of media is a mistake, it's too dismissive and doesn't get to the core of the issue, much like using plot holes as a means to criticize.

While I do like Michael Burnham being Spock's adopted sister, it gave us more information on Spock's childhood, more on Sarek and his fascination on humanity and his belief in IDIC, and I liked the dynamic between Spock and Michael, but I do think it was an unnecessary addition and that the things I liked could have been achieved if she was just Sarak's student as you said, but I personally think the problem with Michael Burnham is she has too many stories going on involving her, they just needed to pick one or two and stick with it.

also the spore drive is an entire different problem not to mention the possibility that the concept was ripped off from that guys video game. but the spinning saucer is something i just don't pay attention to because its stupid, plus i just don't like the design, some new from of drive is fine but they should put some more limitations into it like it only works within this area of space it doesn't extend beyond this area -this way it doesn't give us the why didn't they pull it out to go save voyager or other stuff like that.

It's a little convenient to just shove this 2-season arc of hyper travel that has to never be brought up again. That's pretty much all I care about it though, it just comes off a bit too obvious in overall concept.

On its own though I liked everything that happened surrounding it.

Indeed, I personally like the Spore Drive and hope we get to see more of it in the future, while the science for the Spore Drive is obviously ludicrous, much like a lot of Star Trek technology I do like and appreciate that we do get to see multiple episodes of the applications and repercussions of such a drive, and isn't a one and done episode of the week technology that is forgotten by everyone next time like so many bits of technology throughout the franchise.

Also even before the Discovery when into the future and Starfleet classified the ship, there was enough reasons for why the Spore Drive wasn't developed, like needing a rare creature and forcing it to be a pilot, or getting it's DNA to augment a human and break Federation laws, and other risks like being spun out and looking like the Thing from John Carpenter's The Thing.

[Link8909]

but back to lower decks, i would like to see the crew dealing with some more mundane stuff that is cause by bureaucratic stupidity. Like id like to see them get given the run around trying to fix or deal with something because there is some really convoluted system in place for what they need that just feeds back into itself. like the old you can't get this without a permit and when they go im sorry you can't get a permit without already having the item to register for the permit.

That kind of humor makes me laugh kinda a cross between dilbert and star trek

Sounds a bit over the head of an animated series kinda. I wouldn't say they're made for kids, but a lot of these types of shows are a little more worn on the sleeve.

I think it's going to be a bit of both, I definitely like the comedy of treating the fantastical as mundane as office work, I can easily see and episode in the future where one of the characters are assigned to guard a VIP's quarters and it's just them standing there trying to stave off the boredom.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

but back to lower decks, i would like to see the crew dealing with some more mundane stuff that is cause by bureaucratic stupidity. Like id like to see them get given the run around trying to fix or deal with something because there is some really convoluted system in place for what they need that just feeds back into itself. like the old you can't get this without a permit and when they go im sorry you can't get a permit without already having the item to register for the permit.

That kind of humor makes me laugh kinda a cross between dilbert and star trek

Sounds a bit over the head of an animated series kinda. I wouldn't say they're made for kids, but a lot of these types of shows are a little more worn on the sleeve.

I think it's going to be a bit of both, I definitely like the comedy of treating the fantastical as mundane as office work, I can easily see and episode in the future where one of the characters are assigned to guard a VIP's quarters and it's just them standing there trying to stave off the boredom.

Yeahs maybe we'll see.

[chaos42]

i was saying she was a bit of a mary sue , the adopted daughter part i could take or leave, im saying its not a big issue. the real problem with burnham is the is always right shows up everyone else with her rightness and the laws of the universe bend to make her right in many situations, thats what makes a mary sue and thats the biggest issue i have with her is the world seems to bend around her and warp its own rules to make her write in everything.

also standing around staving off being bored out of your minds sounds like waiting for godot a play were 2 people are waiting for the same person to show up and he never does

[Link8909]

i was saying she was a bit of a mary sue , the adopted daughter part i could take or leave, im saying its not a big issue. the real problem with burnham is the is always right shows up everyone else with her rightness and the laws of the universe bend to make her right in many situations, thats what makes a mary sue and thats the biggest issue i have with her is the world seems to bend around her and warp its own rules to make her write in everything.

also standing around staving off being bored out of your minds sounds like waiting for godot a play were 2 people are waiting for the same person to show up and he never does

Honestly, this is what I call good criticism, you saw an issue with Michael Burnham that someone like myself didn't see, and articulated the problem clearly, so that I can see that point of view, and even the creators can see and make improvements on, of instance in the recent Star Trek Online episode "The Measure of Morality" she is put into situations that she has no control over and has to adapt, my personal favorite is her finding out about Romulans.

But in resent news, Star Trek Lower Decks had a virtual panel at SDCC 2020 with Mike McMahan and the rest of the cast, there are hints to some of the episodes and a teaser clip from the first episode, looks really good, still looking forward to Star Trek Lower Decks, though if anyone wasn't interested in this series I doubt this will change your minds.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

i was saying she was a bit of a mary sue , the adopted daughter part i could take or leave, im saying its not a big issue. the real problem with burnham is the is always right shows up everyone else with her rightness and the laws of the universe bend to make her right in many situations, thats what makes a mary sue and thats the biggest issue i have with her is the world seems to bend around her and warp its own rules to make her write in everything.

also standing around staving off being bored out of your minds sounds like waiting for godot a play were 2 people are waiting for the same person to show up and he never does

Well I get what you're trying to say, but "the universe bending over backwards for her" is pretty vague. That's actually what Spock is deliberately doing, as is explicitly pointed out in season 2 by Michael.